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What we know so far about PE, its causes and its treatment

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  • What we know so far about PE, its causes and its treatment

    This is my 1000th post. I wanted to do something worthwhile with it, so I'm going to use it to try to consolidate everythng I know about premature ejaculation, and everything interesting we've discussed that has promise. As some of you know, I came here with a serious problem I couldn't get under control at all but thanks to certain members (you know who you are) and certain discussions, I'm a long way on the path to beating this affliction.

    Introduction
    I'll start with links to all the main threads of interest (to me at least) and give a little rundown as far as I can. I'm gonna come back to this as I pick more things out, so forgive me if I edit this OP, either to make it clearer or to expand on it. I think it'd be useful to a lot of members to see things in one place. Feel free to discuss on thread of course, and if this grows I'll post a reply to double up the info both here at the start, and later for those following.

    What Causes Premature Ejaculation?
    This is a difficult question to answer as there are many factors and many forms. I will come back to this in time. However, I believe my PE, and many others' (maybe the majority) is a manifestation of a combination of physical imbalance in the pelvic floor from weakness and neglect (perhaps other physiological conditions too) and one's psychological response to arousal. Not exclusively one or the other as there also seem to be other physical factors in play, but those do not seem to be apparent early on or in severe cases.

    Edit June 2012:
    It seems, from recent experiences, investigations and, yes, misadventures that your neurochemistry is involved directly too, specifically serotonin levels in the brain, maybe dopamine too, but it's a bit of a guess what with me not being a neuroscientist and all. But I have found that activities that boost your serotonin levels (Natural supplements such as St. John's Wort, or other more illicit paths) have a dramatic effect on your stamina, to the point where too much can easily bring on DE, quite possibly even inability to climax - so an appropriate balance is necessary. I'll say some more about this whole thing soon, but for now I think St. John's is definitely worth a try. However please consult with your doctor or physician before embarking on any such course of supplements.
    Now I also believe this is complicated as it seems that if one of those needs work but the other is in good condition, a premature condition can still result that is indistinguishable from the result of needing to work on both. This makes diagnosis and appropriate treatment remarkably difficult.

    Learning Self-Awareness
    So where do you start? well. Kegels and edging are most likely your first port of call. The following articles from PEGym's Exercises section (linked above) in case you haven't explored this part of the site yet are found in the Last Longer In Bed section, but I'll reproduce the links here anyway in case you're lazy.
    Kegel Exercises for Men
    Edging
    Ballooning

    I am a firm believer that the best thing you can do to start off is to learn about your body and to learn about your arousal response. Edging and Ballooning will help you with that, as these exercises necessarily keep you aroused and in the zone for longer, so you have time to learn about your body and arousal and gain sensitivity to subtle (and not-so-subtle) changes in sensation as your arousal escalates.

    Minuteman's long and in depth log is a great place to start, as he chronicles his long and extraordinarily detailed journey to understand precisely that. https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...asmic-log.html - Now this is a long read, and Minuteman goes much further and through to MMO (male multiple orgasm) than you may want or need to, but his self awareness is second to none, and if you're a newcomer to the details of your body's arousal process, this is a must-read.

    I truly believe the best thing you can do for your sex life is to take this trip and learn about the most subtle effects of arousal on your pelvic floor, your mind and your body. You can take that as far as you want, but you must start that journey. It will astound you. I cannot count the number of times I've been like "how did I miss that?". If you're anything like me, you might even recognise some things, but because you never took the time and interest, you never really noticed or responded to those things consciously. Now's your chance to start. It might seem like a lot to keep in mind now, but it will become automatic in time. As has been said countless times on forum... it's like riding a bike. You'll never lose these skills.

    A recent addition from BiggD here - https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...-response.html - is NOT to be missed. It's a big one, but he's summed up a whole load of stuff I've mentioned and linked here, and he's presented it in a three week training course that you can't fail to progress from following. Check it out. I insist.

    Peaking - (or advanced edging)
    If you're interested in taking that further, I would strongly recommend seeking out Barbara Keesling's book "How to last longer in bed" where she outlines what she calls Peaking exercises. I think they may be her own creation since interestingly I just read a book of hers for women about heightening pleasure where she also recommends peaking exercises. Anyway, these aren't necessarily for beginners - not because they're bad, but because they're hard if you're not ready for them and that might put you off.

    In brief, peaking exercises are like an advanced form of edging. They require you to be able to identify discrete levels of your arousal from 1-10 where 1 is not aroused at all, and 10 is the PONR (point of no return). You should then use stop/start edging and kegels as you become more familiar with how they affect your arousal to climb to a certain level, say a 7, and then drop down to say, a 4. The object is to creep up increasingly closer to your PONR and dropping down again without blowing. These exercises both build up your tolerance to higher levels of arousal, and they teach you acute awareness of your own sexual response.

    I cannot recommend these exercises enough for honing your self awareness, something that is critical to any successful PreE treatment.

    More Kegels
    Now, moving on, though I probably need to say a little more here, the following threads expand more on kegels and their effects, and discuss different kegels you can do in more depth than the on-site article linked above
    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...c-balance.html and
    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...ness-junk.html

    June 2012 Edit:
    Here's a GREAT post from imac all about Reverse Kegels, explaining exactly what they are and how to do them all. You should definitely check this out: https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...se-kegels.html
    With the discussion out of the way, here's a post from Minuteman's log I linked above (and in his sig at the time of writing) on different kegel exercises you can do that is a great reference. Don't be disheartened if you can't do all of these immediately, some of these are quite advanced and require a high degree of practice and control.
    Minuteman's Kegel Master List

    Now you understand a little more about what's going on with your body and your pelvic floor, it's time for the good stuff.

    Control

    Reverse Kegels as a competing response (pe_Zen's method)
    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...aculation.html - start here. pe_ZEN's approach focuses on combating the muscle contractions that escalate your arousal and using a competing reponse to re-train your body to respond differently. You need to have gained some awareness of yourself and your body's responses to really make use of this approach, but it's part of the package you'll do well to have in your mind. This also relates to a thread I linked lower down about involuntary kegels and I mention some more about this there.

    My thoughts today, some time after reading this the first time are that re-training your body is largely about taking control and exerting dominance over your responses. Your body exhibits involuntary muscle contractions of all kinds, but unlike your heartbeat for example, your pelvic floor should be entirely under your control, and involuntary responses there may as well be the same as having your arms or legs twitching. By forcibly taking over, you're telling your brain that these muscles are yours. not its.

    I've started a new thread on this, about using alternating kegels to exert dominance by flooding your body with messages so it can't get a word in edgeways
    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...dging-sex.html

    Now, you have some ideas, let's discuss a cutting edge insight that will help you on the path to understanding your body. If this helps and inspires you even a quarter of what it did me, you'll be well on the way.

    Establishing Pelvic Floor Muscle balance
    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...ical-cure.html - this is Pegasus' fundamental insight into pelvic floor imbalance. Read this, along with the implications thread linked below. These two threads describe, to my mind, the fundamental root physical cause for ejaculatory dysfunction and conceptually gave me more hope for actually treating my long term premature ejaculation condition than anything I had read previously.

    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...lications.html - This is the daddy. Read the thread above for a simpler heads up on what Pegasus is talking about, and once you get that, come here and learn some more.

    Involuntary Kegels
    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...ry-kegels.html - This was my main insight after exploring Pegasus' balance theory as above. I now believe that to address the physical, and any imbalance you may have, tackling involuntary kegels first is a must, and no amount of kegel exercises will really help until you beat these. It's like a first stage to asserting control over your body. Get rid of them. You have two approaches. pe_ZEN's method as linked above, where you counter the involutary with an RK, or Minuteman's method of taking over the involuntary with a 1-3 second kegel hold before it dies down on its own.

    Psychological Factors
    Drummer19 has put together a really nice post on arousal control here that you should read which is mostly related to the psychological side. In it he mentions both arousal scales, critical to peaking exercises mentioned above (which I must elaborate on) and coins a variation of ballooning to increase tolerance. Go check it out.

    Edit Jan 2013:
    It seems to me after a couple of years dealing with this, generally successfully, but with ups and downs, that in addition to all the talk here about learning control which is highly valuable, your neurochemistry and state of mind (either can influence and be symptomatic of the other) can easily be a contributory factor. Perhaps even the cause itself. Certainly it can be ONE dramatic aggressor, whether ti's responsible alone, or clouds other problems. I wrote a recent breakdown of my experience here, and some fairly thorough discission (educated, if amateur) of the possible mechanisms in play with 5HTP, SSRIs, MDMA and St. John's Wort.
    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...ctiveness.html

    More supporting information here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7657092.stm .. now if I can find that study, it could be interesting.
    Extra Information
    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...race-cure.html - This is an interesting thread with a lot of ideas collected together. Some physical, some psychological. mechanicJT did a great job here. Minuteman addresses mechanics main indicators in reply #21 and goes on to provide a mountain of insight. If you have Pre-E, you should read this.

    As a slight aside, some people talk about desensitisation, and this may be related to one's experience of delayed ejaculation also. I read about, and subsequently recognised the twenty minute effect, where after twenty minutes of stimulation, perhaps through fatigue, continued stimulation is no longer so intense and doesn't push you past PONR so brutally. More info here. https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...y-minutes.html - I recently had this happen after ejaculating, after an hour's continuous edging (didn't have to stop/start - so a wank really). I'm intrigued.

    June 2012 Edit:
    I've got a whole load more to say on this twenty minute effect now, related to neurochemical effects and psychology, the effects of SSRI antidepressants and other serotonin boosting activities. I'll come back to this and tidy up soon as it deserves its own section, but in the meantime, have a look here - https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...-medicine.html, where I've responded in some depth to new member Belg's question on the subject and made some kind of start to summarise my more recent experiences this year.
    June 2012 Edit:
    As you get more advanced and experienced with kegels and your own pelvic fitness, You might consider looking here at Minuteman's Dry Orgasm guide. This isn't directly related to tackling Premature Ejaculation, the DO/MMO journey is more about not allowing Premature Ejaculation to be an obstacle to your pleasure. However (and this is something of a glib guess as I have barely achieved this myself) I would expect that success on this path would also translate to significantly improved self awareness and control anyway, so really, you can't lose!
    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...asm-guide.html
    If you need inspiration, here's something I posted about 2 months after having found all the above.
    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...man-again.html

    Good luck!
    spanky
    Senior Member
    Last edited by spanky; 01-19-2013, 01:59 AM. Reason: adding more links...
    "I want to go to my death bed one day knowing that even when my heart led me into the fire, I fucking did it anyway, and I have the story to tell."

    Everything I know about Premature Ejaculation

    Your dick is almost certainly big enough. Relax

  • #2
    A very good overview.

    I planned to do something similar but in a FAQ form (where i would request a sticky and use it a a main reference point).

    This also helps in seeing the big picture.
    Minuteman
    Member of the Month March 2013.
    Last edited by Minuteman; 05-03-2011, 02:38 PM.
    premE FAQ

    Comment


    • #3
      well done for reading all of it! haha. and thanks
      "I want to go to my death bed one day knowing that even when my heart led me into the fire, I fucking did it anyway, and I have the story to tell."

      Everything I know about Premature Ejaculation

      Your dick is almost certainly big enough. Relax

      Comment


      • #4
        Excellent!

        Comment


        • #5
          This is really good. Perhaps you want to include distractions in the psychological section. I don't mean irrelevant distractions such as naming all the hockey teams in the league, but more beneficial distractions, such as focusing on her pleasure during sex.
          Just a thought, and really good work organizing all this great information.
          Kid

          Comment


          • #6
            wow! That was a very long post spanky. Basically Kegels...Kegels...Kegels. Right? That's what your trying to say. I use have a severe case of "Stick it in and pump and few times and BLOW!" Then i started doing kegels alot...ALOT. Guess what guys. I can control my orgasm and nut when I'm ready..

            No more excuses like:

            My dick is just really senitive....

            Or its because your so hot...

            what a loser the damn bitch already knows that. She wants to get fucked!

            Oh well... Kegels worked for me.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by kidwithPEproblems View Post
              This is really good. Perhaps you want to include distractions in the psychological section. I don't mean irrelevant distractions such as naming all the hockey teams in the league, but more beneficial distractions, such as focusing on her pleasure during sex.
              Just a thought, and really good work organizing all this great information.
              Kid
              That's a great idea. I'll come back when I get a chance and see what I can do.. in the meantime, any recommendations, experiences, good threads or books or what have you... bring 'em on
              "I want to go to my death bed one day knowing that even when my heart led me into the fire, I fucking did it anyway, and I have the story to tell."

              Everything I know about Premature Ejaculation

              Your dick is almost certainly big enough. Relax

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by MaleEnlargementGuru View Post
                wow! That was a very long post spanky. Basically Kegels...Kegels...Kegels. Right? That's what your trying to say. I use have a severe case of "Stick it in and pump and few times and BLOW!" Then i started doing kegels alot...ALOT. Guess what guys. I can control my orgasm and nut when I'm ready..

                No more excuses like:

                My dick is just really senitive....

                Or its because your so hot...

                what a loser the damn bitch already knows that. She wants to get fucked!

                Oh well... Kegels worked for me.
                To an extent, but I think it's a bit more subtle than that. Kegels help you control yourself, but you need good solid arousal awareness to be able to respond the right way too. Enjoying the moment rather than seeing sex as a means to ejaculate is a massive psych trigger dealt with, and taking your time. That gives you a chance to respond to yourself, and as I've said elsewhere, for me, the longer I'm hard and sustaining stimulation before really going for it, the longer I tend to last.

                There's something else going on too, as I'm still having some 30 second sessions, some 20 minute pounding sessions, and occasional endless sessions where I can barely cum. Earlier today in fact, we gave up trying, though I think I had a massive orgasm anyway without ejaculating, or even having orgasmic pumps. If it wasn't for the edging and self awareness work, I'd have found it frustrating that I didn't cum. Instead I was able to recognise it as an orgasm (or three) - some sort of wave anyway, just without ejac, and rather than being frustrated, I was blissed out by it all.

                I think self awareness is stage 1 (recognising the arousal scale and how it all feels), then kicking involuntaries, then good kegel strength for DO etc.
                "I want to go to my death bed one day knowing that even when my heart led me into the fire, I fucking did it anyway, and I have the story to tell."

                Everything I know about Premature Ejaculation

                Your dick is almost certainly big enough. Relax

                Comment


                • #9
                  Your journey continues,your body is finding it's way.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Pegasus View Post
                    Your journey continues,your body is finding it's way.
                    The weird thing is that I feel like my body is finding its own way without my encouragement or needing to direct it now. I guess what I mean is that with a partner everything we've been talking about here, awareness and conscious kegel control etc is just not so practical as it is solo, since if I disappear off into my own sensations I'm not there with her, and girls tend to notice things like that.

                    Nonetheless, I'm still progressing. Cool
                    "I want to go to my death bed one day knowing that even when my heart led me into the fire, I fucking did it anyway, and I have the story to tell."

                    Everything I know about Premature Ejaculation

                    Your dick is almost certainly big enough. Relax

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      In fact it has given a new direction to you. The soft form duo is so sensual, it also tends to be pair bonding.
                      Pegasus
                      Administrator
                      PE Gym Editor
                      PEGym Hero
                      Admin of the Month Mar 2015
                      Last edited by Pegasus; 05-11-2011, 02:29 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Sure seems that way.
                        "I want to go to my death bed one day knowing that even when my heart led me into the fire, I fucking did it anyway, and I have the story to tell."

                        Everything I know about Premature Ejaculation

                        Your dick is almost certainly big enough. Relax

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Nice post Spanky! took me about 3 days to read it because I kept getting side tracked by all the different posts/threads, haha I got lost but that is because I'm new and haven't read a lot of the posts. I can't really remember all of your post now but I would just like to say that, besides this site, the only other thing that has help my P.E is an ebook called 'The ejaculation trainer'. It just help me to understand everything that was happening from first stimulation to ejaculation and it explains techniques/exercises that are talked about on this site. I didn't believe it and I guess I was hoping for an easier solution but after hearing people on this site were using the same techniques/exercises explained in the ebook and were having success, I have decided to give it all a go for myself now. Sooo thank you and I'll try to keep everyone up to date on my journey.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            This thread deserves a sticky

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Great! useful info!

                              Comment

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