HELP!!! One step away from becoming a mass murderer. What the f... am I doing wrong?

[Tyr]

First post, long title.


First of all, I would like to thank you for this wonderful/helpful site. THANK YOU.

Now here's the thing, like many others I've been reading the threads and articles for some time now. Last year in october I started the newbie routine, no result in the first 2 weeks, so I got desperate, started mixing it up a bit with other newbie routines, and finally I started to grow, OH YES. Looking at it now, after 15 weeks, I know I didn't give the first routine enough time to kick in.
My new routine was like this:
1. 15 minute warm up with a rice sock.
2. Helicopter shakes, count to 20.
3. Stretch to the left, 25 quick kegels.
4. While still holding the stretch, pull it straight up, now do 10 circle movements to the left, and 10
to the right (like starting an old car, someone said), release the grip.
5. Do the helicopter shakes again to get blood flowing.
6. Now do the stretch, kegel, circle thing again, only this time stretch to the right.
7. Helicopter shakes again, then continue the stretch, kegel thing again, up, down and straight out,
with helicopter shakes in between. Hope you get the idea.
8. After this, I would do normal stretches, stretch to the right, left, up, down and straight out, holding
for 30 seconds each, getting the blood flowing in between. I would only do the stretch one time in
each direction. My reasons for doing it like this, is because I think that the whole stretch, kegel and
circle movement, stretches the ligs and warm them up nicely, then I stretch them straight one time
in every direction to really let them know.
9. Next I would do 100 jelqs. The next workout I would add a little, working my way up to the 300,
I don't remember how long it took me to get to 300, but a few weeks.
10. Then I would warm down with a half warm rice sock, 5 minutes.

Extra. After a few weeks, when I was done with the workout I would start stretching it straight out,
and hold it there for a few minutes, releasing my grip every once in a while, I did this as
recommended elsewhere, to let the stretch be, while cooling down to normal body temperature.

At first I would do, 1 day on 1 day off, then 2 days on 1 day off, and then 3 days on 2 days off. At one point I tried 4 days on 1 day off, but that didn't feel right, had a little pain in the ligs at night.

I started gaining length in no time (I'll put my results in at the end), but I didn't see any girth changes, I thought it would start coming as I added more jelqs to my workouts, but nothing happened.
In the last 4 weeks I've been doing 400 jelqs (all wet jelqs by the way), same amount of stretches as always (they seem to have worked well so far, but will have to change from now on).
I also started doing the, ``stretch for 2 sec release for 2 sec, then repeat, for a few sets´´ exercise (don't remember the name). I added (which I also don't remember the name of) an exercise where you stretch out, put a finger or two on top, then push down with the fingers while stretching, this is done pressing up, down, left and right, for 4 sets.
Now I know this is a bit much, and it properly caused some overtraining at times, effecting possible length gains, but I've been desperate to gain girth and flaccid length. I still am, especially girth.
1 week ago I decided to start all over with the newbie routine, thinking that I overtrained with the jelqing, but this just seem hopeless.
I've reached a plateau, haven't gained any length in 3-4 weeks and I've never gained anything in girth.
So I was thinking about doubleing my stretching, is this a good idea or not? (*1)
I want to make an ADS (homemade), any tips on how to do? (*2)
And for girth, any suggestion would be received with a smile. What do I do, 1000 jelqs, 2000 jelqs, I don’t know. ANYTHING FOR GIRTH ? (*3)

I’m pretty sure my jelqs are done correctly, every stroke takes 3-5 sec, and I can feel the blood flowing inside, should my grip be harder? (*4)

Something else while I'm here, this thing is confusing.
Now, I'm a big boy, 197 cm / 6 ft 5.5 in, and 111.5 kg / 246 lbs, bodyfat around 15 %.
When I hold my right hand up in front of my face (palm facing my face and fingers together), my hand measures, from tip of middle finger to the point where hand and arm connect: 21 cm / 8.25 in. From the bottom of my pinky finger, and to the bottom of my pointing finger (the width of my palm): 8.9 cm / 3.5 in. When I spread out my fingers and measure from tip of pinky finger to the tip of thumb: 25.2 cm / 9.9 in. All is measured with a non bendable ruler.
This is a somewhat big hand, but not that big, almost all men have the same hand size I think, that's how you can tell sizes in porno.
Now when I look at other members pics, they seem huge downstairs, but some of them are a bit smaller or same size as me (penis size), how the fu.. is that possible? So I think it has to do with hand size, so tell me your hand size folks! (*5)
Measure 1 being hand length (tip of middle finger, to the point where hand and arm connect)
Measure 2 being hand width (only palm, not thumb)
Measure 3 being from tip of pinky to tip of thumb (fingers spread)
...and of course all with a ``hard´´ ruler (1 in = 2.54 cm)
The reason I'm asking is because, I feel like I'm holding a pencil or a piece string.

I forgot to mention, at the end of every workout I would do the thing where I grip really hard at the base, with an erection, and keeping the blood inside the penis for about a minute, when doing this it becomes bigger, but goes away fast, should I hold for longer, 5 minutes maybe? (*6)

Also, I do not understand how you people can do the ``Fowfers´´ / ``Between the cheeks´´ thing, I would love to be able to do them, people say it's great for flaccid length, but if I could get my penis all the way back there I wouldn't have a problem, it's impossible to stretch like that. Mister Fantastic would have problems doing it. Any advice? (*7)

I've only had positive PIs, increased morning and night woods (the night ones are killing me, I'm like a board with a nail in, I don't need any bed guards, I'll tell you that much, ha). The hardness of my erections are great, It's easier for me to get an erection, and I'm hornier as well / horny as hell (now that he doesn't come out to play as much, it's enough that the wind is blowing hard on my crotch, that's insane, ha ha).
But what I haven't had of positive PIs, is increase in normal size and a larger flaccid on workout days.
No negative PIs.
Neutral PIs, I only had increase in size for a few minutes after workouts

* So to sum up all the questions:
1. Doubling my stretches, a good idea or not?
2. How do I make a homemade ADS (all day stretcher)?
3. Jelqs, 1000 or 2000, a bit much I know, but what do I do for girth?
4. Should my grip be harder when jelqing?
5. Your hand sizes folks?
6. Should I hold for longer?
7. ``Fowfers´´ / ``Between the cheeks´´, any advice how?

Feel free to say more than YES or NO, please give any advice you know on this.

Now, I know how to fix my problem, but not in the way I was hoping for. I'll simply start showing up everywhere there's a public shower, gym or whatever, and take every man out (not on a date), who's thicker than me. Hence the title of the thread, mass murderer.
But really, what good would it be, to be the biggest, and then being in jail or 6 ft under!


MY STATS: Started october 15 2008, 5.8 x 5.1 BPEL, 3.7 x 4.1 BPFL (not stretched flaccid, only bone pressed)
Now january 26 2009, 6.5 x 5.1 BPEL, 3.9 x 4.1 BPFL (again not stretched flaccid).
So a gain of 0.7 in, pretty good, I'm happy for that. But all my gains came after 2 weeks of starting, and there haven't been any since christmas, and that's why I think it's time to start stretching some more.
...the reason I do all my measuring in bone pressed, is because I'm losing much bodyfat, (the rat pack, sorry fat pad, ha ha ha, is getting smaller, and causes more penis to be revealed)

MY GOALS: Normally I would be happy with 8 in x 6 in (length x girth) NBPEL, really happy. But since I'm this big, and thinking of starting bodybuilding for real (no drugs), I would love to be 8.5 x 6.3 NBPEL. The reason for it being NBPEL is, I'll have almost no fat in a couple of months, hopefully. And I want to stay that way.
Flaccid, I would like to be like some of the others 7 x 5, this is also just because of me being big. I'm going for 5.5 x 5 flaccid NBPFL (just hanging, not stretched or pressed flaccid)
...all girth is mid shaft, from stats and goals

I need more flaccid and girth, my 2 biggest problems.

Thank you for reading, I don't hope it's to confusing for you to read and understand, if so, please let me know, and I'll try to explain.
Also, I know it's a long post, but I've tried to tell as much, and be as accurate as possible.

Again, THANK YOU

[jayhawk11]

Wow! Very detailed. Try starting from scratch again. Your routine sounds a bit too intense.

When I mean start from scratch, I mean start from the very bottom. Try a very basic routine like this:

10min warm-up
10min stretching
10min wet jelqing
Short cool down

Try this for a couple of weeks. Don't deviate from this plan at all until you can think you are ready to add more.

[Keido]

Measure 1 being hand length (tip of middle finger, to the point where hand and arm connect)
Measure 2 being hand width (only palm, not thumb)
Measure 3 being from tip of pinky to tip of thumb (fingers spread)

Measure 1: 8"
Measure 2: 3 1/2"
Measure 3: 8 1/2"

I'm 6'3", for reference. I really don't think hand size has much to do with penis size, unless you're talking about penises looking larger because a man may have a smaller hand in comparison to yours, so in a reference photo their penis will look larger against their smaller hand. Which makes sense, yeah. I know how you feel being a tall guy and feeling small down there. An 7" penis will look much larger on a guy who's 5'8" than a guy who's 6'5", for example.

So I was thinking about doubleing my stretching, is this a good idea or not? (*1)

Your PI's sound good, so I'd say adding to your workout would be fine. I don't know about doubling it, right off the bat... maybe try adding a 1/3 of your workout at first and if your PI's continue and you still don't see any gains, add another 1/3, and so on and so forth... gotta be patient with all of this because you don't want to injure yourself. It's a very slight area between gains and injury, so you've gotta be careful with all of this... On the other hand maybe you can double up your stretching and see gains, who knows? Everybody's different, heh. I'd recommend trying the +1/3 method first though, go by your PI's and how you're feeling.

I want to make an ADS (homemade), any tips on how to do? (*2)

'Fraid I can't help you on this one, I've always just shelled out the cash for extenders (up to about 3 now...) ... If you try a search on the forums you might be able to find something though.

And for girth, any suggestion would be received with a smile. What do I do, 1000 jelqs, 2000 jelqs, I don’t know. ANYTHING FOR GIRTH ? (*3)

I’m pretty sure my jelqs are done correctly, every stroke takes 3-5 sec, and I can feel the blood flowing inside, should my grip be harder? (*4)

I'm in the same boat you are in terms of length gaining vs girth gaining. Here's what you can try: keep two hands on your penis at all times during the jelq. For example, you've got a hand at the base (which will push the blood forward) and one below the glans. Keeping the grip comfortably tight at the top and using the base grip to push blood forward will engorge the penis in more of a widthy way and should help with gains. The other thing I would say is work up to 20+ second strokes. I'd add 5 seconds to the stroke and work my way up from that, I find that the longer strokes give a good feeling in terms of girth.

I forgot to mention, at the end of every workout I would do the thing where I grip really hard at the base, with an erection, and keeping the blood inside the penis for about a minute, when doing this it becomes bigger, but goes away fast, should I hold for longer, 5 minutes maybe? (*6)

I'm gonna have to let someone else answer this question, I've never really been an Uli master myself. Haven't really had a dedicated enough routine with this exercise to see gains.

Also, I do not understand how you people can do the ``Fowfers´´ / ``Between the cheeks´´ thing, I would love to be able to do them, people say it's great for flaccid length, but if I could get my penis all the way back there I wouldn't have a problem, it's impossible to stretch like that. Mister Fantastic would have problems doing it. Any advice? (*7)

Lie in bed, on your side. Stretch your penis back between your legs as far as it will go. Shove a pillow between your legs in such a way that your penis won't move around. This is a good substitute for the actual sit-on-your-dick fowfer. Good to do before bed.

Hope this helps you out.

[RIB2211]

Take the advice these guys listed! I read through it all and it is everything I would've told you!

On a side note...6 ft 5...246 lbs...15% body fat...please tell me you are a fellow football player

[Big Al]

First post, long title...

I can understand being frustrated at a lack of progress, but I think you made a very poor choice for a title- esp. for a first post.

[Hairtrigger]

Judging by your thread title and first post I would say that you are very tensed up for some reason. Being all tensed up rushing through a workout and advancing too soon will not bring about very good results. Most of the things you were talking about was of little use as far as PE goes. All you need to concentrate on right now is a good solid routine that works for you. It took me 2 months to start showing any gains in length and you only gave it 2 weeks. If you want to do this right take a week off and do what jayhawk recommended.

Stay away from all the advanced exercises, right now this can set you back more than you realize. Start off slow and advance from you 100 jelqs to 300 over the 90 days of your routine. Keep an eye on your PI's, this will tell you what you need to make good gains. Make sure you have rest days, this is when growth will occur. Do not do Uli's now, this exercise can set you back and can take weeks to recover from. Slow and steady is the best way. Good luck. HT.

[Tyr]

I want to start out by apologizing to Big Al and others that may have been offended, it was never my intention to cause any bad feelings or anything like that. Different cultures, different languages and different humor is my only excuse.
I’m sorry, it won’t happen again.
Hope all is forgotten.

Next, I’ve been working like a mad man, so that’s reason it has taken me some days to check up on the thread. The crisis is felt all over the world and if you don’t show loyalty to the company, working longer days etc., you’re out of work.

Now, thank you for all your answers.

Keido, I’m glad you’re feeling me, you being big yourself.
Looking bigger in a small hand is exactly what I mean, yeah.

I’ll try searching for ADS, did you have any good results with it Keido?

Hairtrigger, I got to admit, in the beginning I was rushing through my workout, but only in the first weeks or so. Since then I’ve committed myself 100 % that’s why I became desperate and added all the extra workouts, so maybe I didn’t commit myself 100 %.

So here’s what I’ll do:
Give it a rest for some days, 1 week +, clear my mind and then start with a 100 % commitment
I’ll start out like jayhawk said, from scratch with a very basic routine, after a while (a few weeks) if I feel like nothing’s happening, I’ll do what Keido said, adding 1/3 to my workout, also adding a few seconds to my jelqs, and trying the both hands jelqing technic, it worked for Keido, so maybe it will work for me, all I can do is try.

Will it have any negative effect on my workout, if I do the fowfers you explained Keido?

To rib2011, I used to play football (we call it american football haha, you know football, soccer)
But after to many injuries I had to stop, I almost broke my neck once.
I loved it, still do, I was playing right guard.
I miss it so much, and now scouts from germany and USA are looking this way, if only I could play again.
Football is growing big here in europe, many things have changed since I played. Where do you play?

Again, I didn’t mean to cause anything bad.
Thank you for your answers, it really helped me.

[Big Al]

I want to start out by apologizing to Big Al and others that may have been offended, it was never my intention to cause any bad feelings or anything like that. Different cultures, different languages and different humor is my only excuse.
I’m sorry, it won’t happen again.
Hope all is forgotten.

Not a problem Thanks for addressing this.

[Keido]

I’ll try searching for ADS, did you have any good results with it Keido?
...
Will it have any negative effect on my workout, if I do the fowfers you explained Keido?

I'd say I gained about 1/2" of length with an ADS. I was doing a jelqing and manual stretching routine at the time as well so I don't know how much is directly because of the ADS or because of the jelqing/stretching though. I quit using them because of laziness though, I've just been sticking to a manual routine lately.

I don't think the fowfers will have a negative effect. In most of my research I generally find that stretching can be done pretty much as much as you can do it because it's less intense than girth work, this is also the principle behind an ADS - long time under low tension = gains. Of course, if you get negative PI's because of the fowfering you should cut back on it, but I'm not sure it'd do this to you.

Good luck! I hope your gains start up again.

[Hairtrigger]

Thanks for the response, that was a much better post. Being dedicated and commited to something also means that you need to be patient long enough to see results. You will see us say this over and over and every once in a while we get our point across to someone, take your time with this and it will work for you. If you get in a hurry and try to rush it you will end up overtraining and possibly injuring yourself. This will be time off that could have been spent on a consevative routine that produce's consistent gains.

The ADS or all day stretcher is a good addition to a well structured routine just as pumping or clamping. Manual exercises are the way to go but you don't really need all the gadgit's to see gains.