optimal testosterone

On the one hand, testosterone therapy is a form of treatment that can improve various symptoms experienced by some men as they grow older. On the other hand, testosterone therapy is a means to profit from disease mongering.
For supporters of testosterone therapy like Dr. Morgentaler, the results speak for themselves.
"Indeed," he writes "one only needs to treat five symptomatic men with low testosterone values to become convinced: two will thank the physician profusely for restoring their sexuality and vitality, another two will report solid benefits, and one will not respond."
Prof. Handelsman believes that further research is needed. "That point requires proper evaluation, not wild guesswork by pharma or single-issue proponents who have vested interests in such drug promotion," he told MNT.
Both sides of the debate present their own evidence and refute that of the opposition, putting the lay person who lacks expertise in a tricky position when it comes to making a judgment.
The Mayo Clinic recommend discussing any signs and symptoms that could be attributed to a low testosterone level with a doctor. Being honest with health care providers, making healthy lifestyle choices and seeking help when feeling down are useful steps in tackling problems associated with aging and may help with any decision making about pursuing treatment.
It is likely that the debate surrounding testosterone therapy and aging-related hypogonadism will continue into the near future. For any patients affected by these topics, it would appear best to keep an open mind and listen to both sides of the debate while further research is conducted.

Here is a link to a good article that touches on testosterone / estradoil ratio which is still fairly straightforward .

Some claim this area is so very complex full of interactions yada yadan . The problem with this approach is you have to rely on Endo to workit out and experience shows they can't even get total testosterone right so good luck with that one .
I see onsite regularly that guys have straightforward too little test multi docs have sent them wrong . So the oh boggedy it is too hard for your little heads thing pat on the head leve to the pro's is very counterproductive.
https://www.pegym.com/articles/what-is-male-menopause

This thread is a gold mine. Thanks for the information everyone.

I haven't read the entire thread but I want to add an important part:

Fat.

Fat has the enzyme aromatase that converts testosterone to estradiol, so actually the male body uses estradiol for
some purposes unknown to me, some include bone metabolism. That means that really reducing body fat increases your testosterone level, because less is converted to "bad" estradiol.
The other benefits, such as larger penis, better self esteem and sex appeal are obvious!

I know that from med school, so if you already know, well, sorry!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dr.Valium

I haven't read the entire thread but I want to add an important part:

Fat.

Fat has the enzyme aromatase that converts testosterone to estradiol, so actually the male body uses estradiol for
some purposes unknown to me, some include bone metabolism. That means that really reducing body fat increases your testosterone level, because less is converted to "bad" estradiol.
The other benefits, such as larger penis, better self esteem and sex appeal are obvious!

I know that from med school, so if you already know, well, sorry!

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No need to be sorry it bares repeating .
This is a well known method of natural testosterone increase and well proven to work . Unfortunately it usually requires large weight loss for modest testosterone increase when used as a stand alone method . However it comes into it own when used in combo with other method which are also often health positive .

The general health positive nature of many natural testosterone increase methods means they are worth trying on spec . So lose weight and feel better if your test goes up or not , sleep more ,eat better etc.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dr.Valium

I haven't read the entire thread but I want to add an important part:

Fat.

Fat has the enzyme aromatase that converts testosterone to estradiol, so actually the male body uses estradiol for
some purposes unknown to me, some include bone metabolism. That means that really reducing body fat increases your testosterone level, because less is converted to "bad" estradiol.
The other benefits, such as larger penis, better self esteem and sex appeal are obvious!

I know that from med school, so if you already know, well, sorry!

---

That's very true; it's also important to remember that all hormones are double-edged swords: too or too little is important.

Often in these kinds of discussions Estradiol or, say, Cortisol - are referred to erroneously as "bad" (I know you put it into quotation marks precisely to indicate that E2 isn't per se bad!).

When really, E2 and Cortisol are essential to good health; and we are looking for optimum levels.





.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BigBadButters

That's very true; it's also important to remember that all hormones are double-edged swords: too or too little is important.

Often in these kinds of discussions Estradiol or, say, Cortisol - are referred to erroneously as "bad" (I know you put it into quotation marks precisely to indicate that E2 isn't per se bad!).

When really, E2 and Cortisol are essential to good health; and we are looking for optimum levels.





.

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Quite so and as mentioned in a recent onsite article the proportions between hormones are important .
So at a simple level the proportion between E2 and testosterone as both you and Dr V allude to .
This article speaks to test e2 ratio.
https://www.pegym.com/articles/what-is-male-menopause

I have found this article that points out how handling a gun can increase your testosterone. So to all gun nuts, the irony is that guns can be good for health :)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16866740

I don't live in the US so I can't just by my machine gun at Wallmart *wink*


The other thing are having lots of sexy women around, although you need to have a rival too as it seems...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18675269

So to put it together, the thug's life seems to be the most healthy hormone-wise: Guns and sexy b****es!

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Originally Posted by bignope

fwiw I tried any number of natural remedies with little effect. I have a relatively healthy lifestyle to begin with. Moderate to light alcohol, not overweight, plenty of sleep, moderate exercise. A lot of the stated remedies have very very weak science supporting them. A single study, or a study that has been tested and not reproduced. I would not do TRT in my case though as there are so many downsides and side-effects. Instead I am using clomid in an off label use to boost my natural production. I'm taking the minimum dose of half a pill every other day. So far I am very pleased with the results.

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So you use drugs .

I of course don't know your individual experience, but i can tell you haveing been on the boards a long time, most guys are half assed ,halfhearted and give up easy when it come to natural methods . That said there is no doubt some guys actually need medical help. We are not against medical use of trt and clomid etc but you do mention off label so hmm.
Of the over 100 methods of natural test increase i have looked at the science behind them varies from none to very solid . Simple things like vit d can have a big effect if your level is low. Did you test your vitd level ? How about your zinc level good science behind those . When you say "plenty of sleep" do you mean 8 hrs cause many say that when they get 6 or less hrs . You say moderate exercise there is a lot of scope to change training around with specific weight training to maximise test . And so on and so on.
My initial attempts with natural test increase were unsuccessful but i succeeded because i kept looking for the way forward. Most guys want to take some" supertest" mineral pill and if that doesn't work it's trt.

Usually when test is low and resistant to natural methods there is an underlying reason eg tumor . If you really have diligently tried to increase through natural methods and failed i would be looking for the underlying cause.