Fascia as the limiting factor

[TheLion]

I had a break and I'm only now returning to my exercises. I've had no length gains for a while but at least before the break, my fascia-centric approach seemed promising. I'll have to reconfirm the results and progress in the upcoming weeks.In the meantime, I'm trying to make up my mind regarding the two schools of thought on fascial stretching/elongating: The forceful/microtear/supercompensation approach, or the "suggestive"/massage approach.It would seem to make sense to first start with the suggestive approach and if that doesn't result in gains after several weeks/months, up the intensity to the forceful approach.Regardless, my main approach to PE exercises is now centered completely on fascia, both length- as well as girth- wise. So, application of heat and long, eased-into reps as to not initiate a protective response from the tissue.

Let me know how it goes. I've decided that fascia is my limiting factor too. These are the strategies I've come up with.

• lots of light tension (hanging or extender use)
• lots of heat (continual warm water soaks, heat pads, floor heater, or something similar)
• something to choke blood flow (cock ring, a compression sleeve like a DivoSuit along entire length of penis, etc)
• chemical injections like PGE-1 that unlinks collagen!

I'm really a believer that the last option is the biggest key of all. I even have some knowledge on how to do it, but I never have because I can't get the damn stuff. How unfortunate....

[sixrod]

Many of the current training schools which focus on myofascial treatment have been profoundly influenced by Rolf (1977). In her own work Rolf applied considerable manual or elbow pressure to fascial sheets in order to change their density and arrangement. Rolf’s own explanation was that connective tissue is a colloidal substance in which the ground substance can be influenced by the application of energy (heat or mechanical pressure) to change its aggregate form from a more dense ‘gel’ state to a more fluid ‘sol’ state. Typical examples of this are common gelatin or butter, which get softer by heating or mechanical pressure. This gel-to-sol transformation, also called thixotropy (Juhan 1987), has been positively confirmed to occur as a result of long-term mechanical stress applications to connective tissue (Twomey and Taylor 1982).

(source: Fascial Plasticity – A New Neurobiological Explanation)

Emphasis in the above quote is by me. Anecdotal evidence suggests using considerable force in PE results in an adapted, tougher penis, making further gains more difficult. On the other hand, looking at all the visual evidence regarding the release of tightened fascia, it looks rather violent! The patients are severely bruised even (or especially) when the treatment is considered successful and the patient reports a significant relief.

How this applies to PE, I do not know.

Table 3 Practical applications
WHERE TO WORK:
1. Short and tight tissues
Bring attention to the primary (inappropriately) shortened and hypertoned myofascial
tissues.
2. Include antagonists
Include bringing attention to the antagonistic muscle fibers of the related joint.
3. Respect receptor density
Give extra time and attention to those tissues that have an usually high density with
mechanoreceptors (suboccipital muscles, periosteum, palmar and plantar fascia,
myotendinous junctions, ligaments).
4. Face and Hands
Give high attention to those myofascial fibers that move the face or hands
5. Abdomen and Pelvis
Deep pressure on visceral nerves as well as sustained pressure on the pelvis have been
proven to increase vagal tonus
HOW TO WORK:
6. Timing
For tonus decrease: slow and melting to induce parasympathetic state and to avoid
myotatic stretch reflex
For focusing attention: stimulating, calling attention, more rapid changes, but never
boring.
7. Ruffini-angle
Tangential pressure (lateral stretch) is ideal to stimulate Ruffini organs, which tend to
lower sympathetic tone.
8. Attention to ANS
Pay great attention to the state of the autonomic nervous system
(which influences the body’s overall tonus regulation).
9. Unusual sensations
Create unusual body sensations that are most likely to be interpreted as ‘significant’
by the filtering action of the reticular formation of the central nervous system; i.e.:
(a) unusually strong stretch of those fibers
(b) unusually subtle stimulation (‘whispering effect’)
(c) unusually specific stimulation
(d) sensations that are always slightly changing/moving in a not precisely predictable
manner
10. Immediate feedback inclusion
As soon as you sense the beginning of a tonus change, mirror this back with your touch
in some way to the tissue. The more precise, immediate and refined your feedback
inclusion is, the more effective your interaction will be.
11. Animistic Thinking
Amotherly caring attitude towards lots of little gnomish entities inhabiting the tissue
triggers usually the highest ‘sensory acuity’ in the practitioner’s (mammalian) nervous
system.
CLIENT PARTICIPATION
12. AMPs
Engage the client in active micromovement participation (AMP). The slower and more
refined they are and the more attention they demand, the better.
13. Ask and allow for a deepening of proprioception.
14. Relate body perceptions and movements to functional activities and include the external
space orientation as well as the social meaning aspects of altered body expressions.

Looking at point 9, it could also be that we interpret an accustomed penis as adapted or tough, while it might be just as weak or strong as before, just not as reactive to manipulation as the sensations are not unusual anymore. This would explain why changing the workout often is the solution to hitting a plateau.

I see both unusually subtle (extending, low-pressure pumping) as well as unusually strong (clamping, hanging, stretches/jelqs/ulis/squeezes/UJs etc) typical to PE. Specific they might be always, as the target of the manipulation is a relatively small area. I'm not sure if the fourth sub-point, "always slightly changing/moving", is being explored much. How could we achieve that? Instead of repeating hundreds of jelqs, maybe interleaving the exercises would gain extra benefits? Food for thought.

[MrPriapus]

Hey sixrod, have you come to any other new conclusions regarding your research. I've never seen the "thick cord" issue approached from these angles. Thank you for sharing.

[sixrod]

Unfortunately no hard evidence to report. The fascia is called the "organ of form" and it makes perfect sense for it to be the limiting factor, but there's no data to support either way, at least until the bodybuilding community makes a breakthrough in manipulating fascia (which they find limiting muscle growth) and we get to apply to results to PE as well.

[DickerSchwanz]

Never occured to me. This is the #1 limiting factor.
Fascia is all over the CC's and Tunica!?
Only the CS is kind of free from it it seems.

[lowpang]

So what's the best way to cause deformation? With heat and stretching? How much heat is best.

[Yotguy]

So how do we employ this all? 'Sounds fascinating.

[geo3]

Just a cursory observation, this line of thought may indicate that lightly massaging the tissue of the bucks fascia and the attaching elements would invoke a viscoelastic fluid to go from one more solid state to another more fluid one. Thus allowing the facia to be more receptive to manipulation. I need more on this. If the idea is valid then picking the proper stress mechanism is crucial to changing it permanently for "gains". Maybe looking too far down the single-track on this. There must be more to it?

[closed224]

Using massage has been excellent for me.

[WantMore12]

This was a great analysis and some serious food for thought.

General question. Is there a way to flag this in my settings so I can refer back to it. Not sure how the forum settings can do.