Girth Fatigue

[MainSqueeze88]

Ok so although Ive been with the PE culture for several years this is my first post ever on any forum.... ever. Although I have done enough reading to make a college thesis. As far as girth is concerned we are stretching the girth layer of the Tunica by expanding it. The Tunica is Connective Tissue. Everything I read about stretching connective tissue suggest low-force, longer duration stretching. It means dont squeeze, pump or clamp with too much pressure. I have never followed this rule. I am taking a short 2 week decon and am going to follow this advice for real and see how it works. I will go much softer when squeezing. I have also read this to be true from one of the legends Saiyan22 aka Kingsnake. This is regarding "creep" when stretching connective tissue. Peace

[eiffel]

I have given up on clamping for now because I didn't gain anything in three months of intense clamping, I needed to do 20 minute sets (manually, mechanical clamping never got me very good expansion) to even start to feel any sort of sensation at all from my the expansion, which tells me that my TA is so elastic that I must go to like 1.25" expansion to deform it at all.

I think if you don't get large expansion during a set, that may actually be a good thing. A less flexible dick deforms easier.

I am going back to hanging for now, hoping to gain some length (target is still 8 inches) and base girth before going back to clamping, or possibly pumping.

[namsokiek]

If your TA expands as much as you say then it is not your limiting factor, smooth muscle is the limiting factor.

You need to proceed with exercises that will build the smooth muscle so it fills the CC to its maximum expansion.

[eiffel]

Shouldn't the hypoxia and expansion from clamping lead to hypertrophy/hyperplasia in the SMC?

[MainSqueeze88]

Truth be told (and I'm very familiar with Radioheads original Tunica vs. smooth muscle/limit factor) any exercises that exercise and expand the cc smooth muscle will eventually also stretch out the girth tunica layer anyway. Clamping, squeezes, jelqs you name it all work out the cc smooth muscle as well as the tunica girth layer.I still believe less force longer duration is the best and having patience. Also doing exercise at 100% erection level or near 100% is best. Some of the veteran best girth gainers will agree. I do not buy into the whole tunica is more pliable at lower erect levels, it just seems that way. The only reason it seems more rigid at higher levels is because it is stretched out to the max. This means that it takes less force on your part to stretch it beyond it's max. As far as gaining max expansion during your workout I do not believe that is so necessary for long term permanent gains. Do not squeeze the living daylights out of your dick.

[namsokiek]

Shouldn't the hypoxia and expansion from clamping lead to hypertrophy/hyperplasia in the SMC?

I think the more appropriate question would be, "Has clamping lead to ..." In this case, no it has not. It appears that your tunica is flexible enough to accommodate more smooth muscle so I recommend another method to gain smooth muscle.

Truth be told (and I'm very familiar with Radioheads original Tunica vs. smooth muscle/limit factor) any exercises that exercise and expand the cc smooth muscle will eventually also stretch out the girth tunica layer anyway. Clamping, squeezes, jelqs you name it all work out the cc smooth muscle as well as the tunica girth layer.I still believe less force longer duration is the best and having patience. Also doing exercise at 100% erection level or near 100% is best. Some of the veteran best girth gainers will agree. I do not buy into the whole tunica is more pliable at lower erect levels, it just seems that way. The only reason it seems more rigid at higher levels is because it is stretched out to the max. This means that it takes less force on your part to stretch it beyond it's max. As far as gaining max expansion during your workout I do not believe that is so necessary for long term permanent gains. Do not squeeze the living daylights out of your dick.

I can see where your coming from with this but my experiences differ significantly. When I clamp or pump there is little additional expansion, about 1/4". If my tunica does not expand sufficiently to allow the smooth muscles to increase in size, they can never get big enough to multiply. If I cannot generate the internal force sufficient to stretch the erect tunica then I cannot get bigger.

One note about girth work and erection level. When fully erect, the radial strands and the longitudinal strands of the tunica reinforce each other. I would measure my girth while doing a clamped compressor at full erection then again at 85-90% erection. The total expansion as a result of the squeeze was greater at lower erection levels. In other words, I would measure 5 3/8" full erection and 5 1/2" - 5 5/8" at lower erection level.

[MainSqueeze88]

Ahh interesting!? So Namsokiek, I believe what your trying to say is that at 100% erection level while you are doing girth exercises you have to work against both the length (longitudinal) and girth (radial) layers of the tunica and stretch both whereas if it were semi- erect 60-70-80% you only have to worry about the girth layer counteracting and stretching which would be ideal if your only targeting girth (I only want to target girth). If this is really true I don't think I would spend one more second doing any girth exercises at 100%. This could be a game changer. Namsokiek, how do you know for sure this is the case. I'm using my spatial reasoning and I guess I can see this, and it would definitely explain the extra rigidity at higher erection levels. Either way though whether I end up prescribing to this semi level erection girth exercising isolating only the girth layer, I will still prescribe to lower force long duration expansion/stretch as I keep hearing from sports trainers this is how you stretch connective tissue as opposed to muscle. Anyway now I am at a crossroads, and Namsokiek REDZuLU from MoS who made the clamp guide always said 100% was best. Perhaps I should try it exclusively your way for a couple months at only semi-erect. How have your permanent longterm girth gains been by the way, if you could give me any pointers towards my girth gaining goal, it would be greatly appreciated.

[MainSqueeze88]

Namsokiek I will check out your girth guide as well. Im an old vet so Im conditioned. I own a Bathmate and have some cable clamps.

[MainSqueeze88]

Also if "When fully erect, the radial strands and the longitudinal strands of the tunica reinforce each other" would it make sense to spend some time only stretching the longitudinal (even though I dont want length) and then go back to girth exercises?

[namsokiek]

Ahh interesting!? So Namsokiek, I believe what your trying to say is that at 100% erection level while you are doing girth exercises you have to work against both the length (longitudinal) and girth (radial) layers of the tunica and stretch both whereas if it were semi- erect 60-70-80% you only have to worry about the girth layer counteracting and stretching which would be ideal if your only targeting girth (I only want to target girth).

Note: I recommend girth exercises occur at 85-95%. Erection levels of 60-80% are only good for jelqing.

If this is really true I don't think I would spend one more second doing any girth exercises at 100%. This could be a game changer. Namsokiek, how do you know for sure this is the case. I'm using my spatial reasoning and I guess I can see this, and it would definitely explain the extra rigidity at higher erection levels.

For discussion on the lattice structure of the tunica, see Diane Kelly: What we didn't know about penis anatomy | Video on TED.com

Anyway now I am at a crossroads, and Namsokiek REDZuLU from MoS who made the clamp guide always said 100% was best. Perhaps I should try it exclusively your way for a couple months at only semi-erect. How have your permanent longterm girth gains been by the way, if you could give me any pointers towards my girth gaining goal, it would be greatly appreciated.

Clamping, which I don't consider to be girth "work" or an "exercise", should be done at the highest erection level possible. Exercises which should be done at 85-95% are horse squeezes, compressors, my modified frendos, erect bends, etc; things which require movement.

Regarding my gains. I was doing girth exercises for a couple months, mainly clamping, clamped bends and squeezes for months and gained nothing. I started pumping, following a moderate pace (see here) and still saw no gains. Then I looked closer at the exercise routines and noted they all mentioned doing the work at 85-95%. I then devised my girth routine and followed it for about a month. I gained 1/8" in a month, where I had not gained for the previous 4 months.

Shortly afterwards I made my Homemade LG and shifted emphasis to length. I have maintained my girth gains since. I pump periodically but it is not an emphasis. I may shift emphasis after 200 hrs on my LG.

Also if "When fully erect, the radial strands and the longitudinal strands of the tunica reinforce each other" would it make sense to spend some time only stretching the longitudinal (even though I dont want length) and then go back to girth exercises?

Stretching will target the septum, which does not affect girth. I recommend erect bends or bundled stretches because they will engage the the outer longitudinal layers of the tunica.