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  • Beginner PreE Routine Member Input Thread

    Lets design a beginners routine for people who just found this site!

    1. If you could go back in time before you started curing your Pre what would you teach yourself first?
    2. What do you think an absolute beginner should start with?
    3. What is your current routine?
    4. What other questions would a beginner routine answer?
    5. Besides the Hindi Squat thread is there any other thread that not in the sticky that every beginner should know about?
    SoftMmoNoPreE
    Senior Member
    Last edited by SoftMmoNoPreE; 02-20-2017, 11:46 PM.
    Nerdy Stuff for PreE Beginners

  • #2
    1.)
    a. I would teach myself that my pelvic floor is tight because the rest of my body is too lose
    b. I would teach myself meditative reverse kegels and tell myself to do them with every breath while expanding as much of my body as possible.
    c. MMO is awesome and hardMMO is not as hard to learn as it sounds.
    d. Basic anatomy knowledge will help a lot.

    2.) This is a hard question because everyone is different. Everyone comes to this site with different skills, abilities, different types of PreE and different causes of PreE. I think a plan divided into categories of actions and levels of skill within those exercises would be good. Which levels I should include and there order I have no idea.

    a. Reverse kegels. Lvls? 1. Can't do them 2. Have to bear down to do them 3. Do them while inhaling 4. Do them while exhaling 5. Realize a decrease in resting tone of the pelvic floor
    b. Edging edging progression thread
    c. Hindi lvl 1. Have pain 2. Get to parallel 3. Hips below parallel 4. Heels up 5. Heels down 6. RK while calmly breathing at bottom
    d. Frog stretch 1. Static on elbows 2. Rock back and forth on elbows. 3. Rock on palms 4. 3 with an RK
    e. Massage good for getting to know your pelvic floor. 1. BC kegel feel the tension with your hands and then massage that area. 2. PC kegel then massage 3. IC kegel then massage

    3.) I'm kind of on a maintenance routine right now. My time in Hindi has been higher, and the kinds of RKs I do has changed over the months.
    3x2min "Frog" stretch
    3x5min Hindi Squat
    Meditative reverse kegels all day trying to expand the sides of my abs on the inhale and RKing both on the inhale and exhale. It ends up being .5-2 hours depending on how much attention Im paying and what Im doing that day.
    Edging when I wake up for 20 minutes while meditative reverse kegeling. Sometimes also an edging session at night.

    4.)
    a. Q. What is an RK and how to do one? A. I think an RK is a voluntary reduction in tone of a specific muscle regardless of increase of tone of any other muscles, but smart people have differing definitions.
    b. Q. How do I learn how to RK correctly? A. The same way you learn to do anything; trying, failing, studying, and repeating.
    b. Q. How long will this take? A. No idea everyone is different. There are different types and causes of PreE. You should experience some success by three months in or your routine is bad.
    c. Q. I'm not experiencing success yet how is my routine bad? A. Start a log with your name in the title. A lot of smart people who've already cured their PreE spend an inordinate amount of time reading logs and giving advice. Take advantage of that and follow their advice if it makes sense and sometimes even if it doesn't.
    SoftMmoNoPreE
    Senior Member
    Last edited by SoftMmoNoPreE; 02-20-2017, 07:23 PM.
    Nerdy Stuff for PreE Beginners

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    • #3
      A Quote from Minuteman with everything I would want to say to myself in May 2016 but you know...eloquent.

      Originally posted by Minuteman View Post
      "You are approaching it from a wrong direction".

      Is what I really want to just say, but it would be pointless and even somewhat offending probably, but time lends you a good perspective on things and I am going to give you an insight into that perspective for a while and allow you to get to your own conclusions.

      Something that Pegasus mentioned is really the issue here but on a different scale.

      Sigh it seems to me you are like a boxer who doesn't want to work the bag or do the road work but expects to spar well and do well fight night .
      As you have mentioned your issue is complex but most of the complexity is in your mind, it is a recurring pattern that I keep noticing with people with premE where they tend to focus on just one direct problem and not see the bigger problem, or fail to identify premE as a symptom or a consequence of bad habits.

      I am also guilty of this for such is a mind of a person that tends to over-analyze every part, while it is good for a deeper more comprehensive understanding of a problem it is also leading you in a wrong(ish) direction.

      What you need is a more holistic approach to your problem. Lets take porn for example, most of the time when you see a person really displaying a fascinating stamina in bed most of the time that person has a fascinating stamina over all, that person sweats and is even in some causes straining (depending on the difficulty of the scene), in other words sex is demanding, good sex is even more.

      But sex is also very simple (trust me I am only a 30 something year old virgin) because your body is pretty much hard wired to do it, but the problem is the sensitivity and the inability to turn off during it, to lose your self to the motion to experience the sex and edging with all of your body, not to mention the bad habits, and I do not mean just sexual habits but one such as poor posture (forward head, rounded shoulders, anterior pelvic tilt etc etc), bad sleep cycle, lack of movement.

      Think about your body as a pressure pot that has an ability to vent but also has multiple layers of hatches that can be opened to allow the pressure (and the pleasure) to go to a higher level. What you are currently having a problem with is that you are building all of your pleasure and pressure in the pelvic floor and just keeping it there. In other words you are not experiencing the arousal with all of your body just the pelvic floor, once you learn how to release the pressure you will also notice that whole of you body will get much hotter.

      Now we come to the second part of the problem. When you are out of shape your body cannot really handle that much of the arousal because of your own sensitivity and inability to be relaxed during high arousal, because venting (exhaling and relaxing) can only help you so much. Now it seems totally logical to me but I am guilty of not making that connection before, but how can one expect to last long in bed for example if one cannot last that long for example running, or just being in that position without getting tired.

      In other words, you need to train your body, you need to make it stronger. That brings many benefits but most importantly for you right now, you gain endurance, confidence, and the ability to think with your body more, as you gain understanding of your pelvic floor by experimenting you will learn more about your body beyond it (and start to make connections) that will vastly benefit you sexually, you will notice that you are to strained around the shoulders and notice how when you are relaxed after a workout you can last longer (similar to when you have a drink or two), you will start to feel pleasure from the movement of you body during edging which will allow you to change your focus and learn how to move your arousal focus around your body, and so much more.

      How can anybody expect to perform good in bed if you keep sitting down most of the time of your day, especially if you have been doing it for years. I mean now it seems like the most logical thing ever, but there was a time where I did not make a connection about my whole body endurance and sex endurance but wholly focused on my pelvic floor (which did though me a lot of useful stuff but it also kind moved me in a wrong(ish) direction).

      But, this should not stop your progress in experimenting and learning about your pelvic floor as you are doing, but it should add a new dimension.

      I understand that you position is complicated, but do not make that you excuse, everybody thinks their position is complicated (and it is because that is most of the time the only perspective you have) but understand truly what you goals are, and realize that in order to achieve them you must train your whole body.

      And this might not be something other agree upon but what they don't know most of the time if how weak somebody can physically be, it simply does not occur to them the degree of physical weakness one person might have and how much it impacts performance, you yourself might no even understand (but if you are anything like me I think you very well do).

      Overcoming premE is for some much more than just overcoming the ejaculating part, it is about changing your entire lifestyle (from the bad habits, to the diet and workout, to the mindset etc, and even if you thing you are doing enough to change it chances are you are not doing enough) to the point that it barely resembles your previous, because the problem is much more deeply rooted and if not treated at the core it will come back, which doesn't mean that one should not treat the symptoms as well, but the faster you see the bigger picture the better.

      And here lies the biggest problem, the "bigger picture" needs experience, I can keep writing about this for even more paragraphs (and I usually do) but you will need to go trough some trial and error before you can really see it, so this is more like a preview in some ways (because for me as well there is a lot I still don't know).

      So, bottom line. Go to a doctor and consult about exercise and your prolapse, educate yourself on dos and don'ts of it, and then go to the gym, pool or whatever form of more intense exercise and stick with it for a year or two, while continuing the path that you are already going now. Focus on building strength but also endurance, dedicate at least one day a week for cardio (regardless of you weight, you need to good cardiovascular health in order to last long in bed as well), learn how to eat properly if you are not (and chances are you are not) and make movement an integral part of you day, as the time passes and you start using your body more and your brain less (at least for over-analyzing and paying to much attention on your performance) and as you start feeling the pleasure (of sex and the movement itself) more and more with your body you will start to progress nicely.

      I apologize for a long and for some rather pointless post, but take it from someone who has a similar path to yours and take at least some shortcuts.

      Good luck.
      SoftMmoNoPreE
      Senior Member
      Last edited by SoftMmoNoPreE; 02-20-2017, 10:07 PM.
      Nerdy Stuff for PreE Beginners

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      • #4
        Anatomy for PreE sufferers 10 hours total

        Spending ten hours studying anatomy early in your journey will greatly decrease the total number of hours you spend curing your PreE.

        The medical jargon used doesn't matter much. Let it wash over you. I know this throws a lot of medical jargon at you, and you will be scrambling to remember old biology and chemistry. Keep watching if you are confused. Try to imagine the area on your own body and what it feels like. Touch it, too.

        Levels are in order of my perceived importance for PreE. When you're struggle try searching on an earlier level for the answer.

        The time at the end is the length of the videos in that lvl. The 10 hour estimate for completion of this section assumes you spend a lot of time googling the parts you don't understand.

        Lvls 1-4 are super important which other parts to learn is up to your particular dysfunction. I'd recommend learning the adductors, abs, glutes, hip flexors and hamstrings in that order because they were important to me.

        The Basics

        Lvl 1 Control of tone - Why are you so tense, bro? 25 min.

        Starts with the best 19'35" summary of how muscles work I've found. Then moves to control of tone and movement.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcj36RYvd1s

        Lvl 2 The perineum - Erection and Ejaculation 17 min

        IC and BC locations explained. This is the best explanation I've found of the superficial perineum.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgUzlJmOOMs

        Lvl 3 Penis - Your Dick in 4 min

        4 min seems like too little to explain a penis but he does it. My dick is worth at least 8 min of explanation.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=razkCzuRgak

        Lvl 4 Pelvic Floor - Breathing and Not Pissing Yourself. 18 minutes.

        These 18 minutes will help you so much when it comes to asking smart questions about your PreE.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3BBAMWm2Eo
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0Ax3rLFc6M

        The Specialists

        Lvl 5 Adductors - 10 min

        These muscles pull your thighs together. Activating these seems to inhibit BC contraction in Reciprocal Inhibition Edging.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjPAPTJdxa8

        Lvl 6 Abs - 14 min

        One important part of the abs for PreE is that by pulling up on the hips and rotating them posteriorly the weight of the internal organs shift from being on the thin weak BC muscle to the big PC muscle. The other is smolthing out the force created by inspiration.

        Since your internal obliques basically become the Cremaster and the external oblique forms part of the sheath in which it runs, it also helps to learn the layers of your abs and the direction their fibers run. Internal oblique fibers run up and to the midline = Pulling together and up. Don't confuse this with the rectus abdominus which is only up and more superficial. External oblique fibers run down and to the midline = Bearing down. The transversus abdominus is the deepest layer and runs horizontally.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxOajxO8mX0

        Lvl 7 Glutes
        - 7 min

        The glutes pull back on the coccyx letting more space for the pelvic floor to do its job. This video starts with a good 1 min explanation of the various movements of the thigh and is worth watching just for that.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHJwCzzWqhE

        Lvl 8 Hamstrings - 7 min

        The activation of the most medial hamstring was important in my PreE. I think strengthening these muscles are important if you have anterior pelvic tilt.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAMWumkerRA

        Lvl 9 Hip Flexors
        - 7 min

        You hip flexors are probably tight if you sit a lot, and they can pull you hips out of allignment forcing more weight on the BC than should be there

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovQYBAiv8cI

        The Baby Makers

        Lvl 10 Spermatic Cord
        - Ab-Balls. 9min

        I didn't know how much of my abs were in my balls untill I watched this.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bu_1wh7ycVA

        Lvl 11 Nerves - Your brain is an octopus. 15min

        The nerves of stimulation, erection, emission and ejaculation. Hope you've been looking things up in the dictionary because this guy assumes you already know a LOT of anatomy.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwGV6XRo8nc

        Lvl 12 Vas deferens and Accessory Glands - Tubes and Bulbs! 7 min

        Or really one tube with lots of different, hard to remember names.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39OKrzU3i1w

        Levels to add

        Bones of the hip, spine, breathing, squatting, internal/medial roators

        Order of levels and other levels that should be in this section are open to debate.

        If you have problems understanding something on a level maybe I can help.
        SoftMmoNoPreE
        Senior Member
        Last edited by SoftMmoNoPreE; 04-05-2017, 12:16 AM.
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        • #5
          https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...ulation-2.html

          https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...html?highlight=
          Pegasus
          Administrator
          PE Gym Editor
          PEGym Hero
          Admin of the Month Mar 2015
          Last edited by Pegasus; 02-22-2017, 05:16 AM.

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          • #6
            1.
            A. What triggers my Tension
            B. The A&P of the PF
            C. How to not be upset at myself

            2.
            A. Observe your body and understand what happening to it.
            B. A&P of the Pelvic area.
            C. Triggers

            3.
            Currently RK and Hindi squats
            as much as possible. RK all day.
            RK holds while active and moves.
            Hindi squats use this as a new way to sit. Play video games, read, ect.
            Regular kegals maybe once a day, or twice a week.

            Wet Death grip. Edge as often as possible, for as long as possible. 10mins minimum.
            Practice relaxing of tension during edging, tightening muscles leg, PF, ect. Reverse the bad habits of my youth, the poor masturbation habits/reflexes.

            Keep the arousal/pleasure from over running myself and pushing me into tension.
            Learn how to let stimulation wash over me, and not cause me lose control.
            (Wet Death Grip is built up during the edge session, more intensely as time goes on. Also ballooning if the PONR is near and the DG is to much)

            4.
            I think a timeline, or break down of what happens before/during/after ejaculation could be helpful.

            Reasons why and how exercises help with PreM.

            Misconceptions

            5.
            Here are just a few threads I found useful:
            Three exercises was insightful for me.
            3 exercises
            Good read.
            MM log

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            • #7
              Good additions
              Nerdy Stuff for PreE Beginners

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Polyorchid View Post
                4.
                a.I think a timeline, or break down of what happens before/during/after ejaculation could be helpful.

                b.Reasons why and how exercises help with PreM.

                c. Misconceptions
                Sexual Response

                It's complex. I divide it into 5 non linear phases to distinguish orgasm and ejaculation.

                Desire - I want to fuck

                Excitation - Its getting better


                You get erect in this stage. You feel more and more pleasure. You get increasingly tense. IC IKs help maintain good EQ. BC IKs start taking you to PONR. Some of you skip this stage so learn plateau edging.

                Orgasm - Its all in your head

                Orgasm is separate from ejaculation. Orgasm is a mental state like anger or peace. It is often accompanied by involuntary rhythmic releases of tension = Involuntary reverse kegels.

                Involuntary reverse kegels (IRK) and Involuntary Kegels (IKs) feel almost identical. IRKs are the contractions you feel during orgasm/ejaculation. Not sure if this is useful if you aren't trying for MMO. You should be trying for MMO though.

                Involuntary reverse kegels (IRK) Involuntary Kegels (IKs)
                Involuntary Involuntary
                Sudden Contraction Sudden Contraction
                Weaken over time Build on each other
                End with lower muscle tone Lead to higher tone

                Ejaculation - Making babies

                Ejaculation is a positive feedback loop. Sensation -> Tension -> Increased sensation -> Tension -> Increased sensation -> Ejaculation. Because we love the increased sensation we must break this loop in the tension phase. The process of curing PreE is to a large extent one of getting great at relaxing the pelvic floor. In order to do that well you probably need more strength and control of the antagonists to the pelvic floor which include: abs, adductors, hip flexors and glutes.

                Ejaculations are generated in the spine in an area called the spinal generator of ejaculation (SGE). You can ejaculate with a broken back, if it's above a your lower back (L3-5).

                Your genital area connects to the SGE. The brain has both inhibitory and excitatory connections to this area. The inhibitory connections to the SGE come from the bottom part of the brain stem (ventral medulla).

                While edging visualize your brain stem telling your low back to relax and calm down.

                Resolution - The End

                I think of this as basically synonymous with refractory period because dry orgasm (DO) dumps you back into the excitation phase. You can't get an erection or ejaculate for a while. Maybe so you don't fuck the sperm out of the woman you are trying to impregnate. Maybe so you don't fuck yourself to death. Maybe so you can bond with your woman.

                Exercise Explanations

                Physiologic/Progress Indicators (PI): Signs you're doing it right
                Negative Physiologic/Progress Indicators (NI): You're doing it wrong.

                Edging - Helps you learn what your personal triggers to ejaculation are; in which positions, in which mental states, with how much tension and where. Go close to the edge and fail often. Especially early. Ejaculating when we are trying not to is what we are learning to avoid. You have to be supremely aware of yourself while doing this so...
                PI: last longer, more control, better EQ, more relaxed, closer to PONR for more of the time
                NI: shorter, worse EQ, more tense, ejaculating every time


                Quitting Porn - Edging will take 100% of your focus you can't be edging to porn. Added bonus: you might start viewing women as people instead of art objects. If you can't get a great erection by yourself without porn that's a problem. Fix it.
                You want to be able to maintain a 10/10 EQ regardless of the sexual situation. 10 EQ while alone. 10 EQ the 12,753 time you fuck your wife and she's not super into it.

                When you first start edging it's super boring, and maintaining great EQ is hard. Eventually getting a 7 EQ becomes a habit as you learn to let blood flow into the CCs. Then the IC contractions to take you to 10 EQ become habit.

                By watching porn to get 10 EQ you are creating a habit where increasing EQ is done with visual or mental stimulation instead of muscular control.

                BC and IC muscles in erection and ejaculation
                PI: Worse EQ temporarily (one week of normal EQ followed by a dropoff lasting months is reported?, I've found a 1 week dropoff followed by gradual improvements), anxiety, withdrawals, desire to improve following relapse.
                NI: relapses?

                Hindi Squats - Below parallel your hamstrings + glutes become postural muscles. Moves the insertion of the levator ani (LA) away from its origin allowing it to stretch.
                If you can't feel a stretch in the Hindi squat.

                Do a light pull (10-20% strength) with the antagonists to the pelvic floor when in the bottom of the squat.

                Activate your glutes to pull back, and then pretend you are going to stand up to activate your hip flexors. Don't actually stand up. You shouldn't even move.

                Push in slightly against your elbows to activate the adductors then pull up with your abs.

                It will be much tougher than resting at the bottom and your times will drop, but the automatic inhibition of the pelvic floor by activation of the antagonists should help you get a stretch.
                PI: feel a stretch, lasting longer, smother while standing up from the squat, broader muscle awareness, delayed onset muscles soreness (you may feel pleasantly sore like you've gone to the gym)
                NPI: pain (especially sharp, shooting, tingling nerve-type pain), incontinence,

                Meditative Reverse Kegels (MRK) - Allows you to judge your current level of tension in the pelvic floor. Over time (weeks/months) they allow you to gradually decrease your resting tone. As you breathe in your abdomen increases in pressure as the diaphragm moves down into it. Two major muscle groups should move in relation to this increase in pressure; abs and pelvic diaphragm (LA + ). They should move in a smooth and synchronous way.
                PI:less tension in the abs, greater movement of the pelvic floor, doing them by habit, light trembling of the pelvic floor, pleasant, calming
                NI: pain, straining, bearing down,

                Reverse Kegels - Your brain controls your muscle tone. You politely and repeatedly ask it to lower that tone. Your brain learns when pelvic floor tension is necessary and when it isn't.
                PI: gradual decrease in resting tone, pelvic floor tone changes based on activity and body position, meditative reverse kegels become smoother
                NI: pelvic floor tone is static while moving, bearing down or forcing it

                Lightest Possible K to RK - Your smallest weakest muscle fibers are always activated first. These fibers are the ones that it's most important to be able to relax because you'll use them the most. This trains those muscles to get increasingly good at relaxing.
                PI: Your time to complete relaxation decreases=faster reps
                NI: Subsequent reps get stronger, incomplete relaxation

                Modified Thrusting
                - You get better at fucking by fucking. Pick a sexual position you're terrible at and imitate it while MRKing. Then do it while aroused into you hand/fl.eshlight/awesome girlfriend. Some increase in tension in the pelvic floor while thrusting is normal. Your ability to relax that tension is bad. So a tiny contraction necessary for balance adds on itself and builds to an IK then to ejaculation.
                PI: Smoother thrusting, less tension, slower build of tension
                NI: pain

                Misconceptions

                This wont work. It will

                This will be quick. It won't be.

                This will be easy. It can't be otherwise you would have already fixed yourself.
                SoftMmoNoPreE
                Senior Member
                Last edited by SoftMmoNoPreE; 02-23-2017, 02:22 PM.
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                • #9
                  I found this break down a bit ago.
                  But it still wasn't a detailed as I'd like it to be.
                  How erection and ejaculation occur

                  RK- the forcing urine out with abs tightened- these oddly help with my sensation felt in my fernelum.
                  I'm unsure how though, I'm "assuming" abdominal pressure apply to the nerves in the area causes a sort of numbing effect. I'm not entirely sure if the effect is universal among guys either.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Depends on how detailed you want it Polyorchid. There's insane detail if you want it and are willing to read a lot of jargon in scientific studies.

                    Neural Control of Erection
                    BC and IC muscles in erection and ejaculation
                    Physiology of Penile Regidity
                    Physiology and Pharmacology of Ejaculation
                    SoftMmoNoPreE
                    Senior Member
                    Last edited by SoftMmoNoPreE; 02-23-2017, 01:38 AM.
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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Polyorchid View Post
                      I found this break down a bit ago.
                      But it still wasn't a detailed as I'd like it to be.
                      How erection and ejaculation occur

                      RK- the forcing urine out with abs tightened- these oddly help with my sensation felt in my fernelum.
                      I'm unsure how though, I'm "assuming" abdominal pressure apply to the nerves in the area causes a sort of numbing effect. I'm not entirely sure if the effect is universal among guys either.
                      I think this is terrible. Bearing down like that is connected to incontinence. If your pelvic diaphragm doesn't yet move when you breathe try lifting your abs towards your head and breathing into the space you've just made

                      Your brain controls your muscles, nerves, and reflexes. An RK at it's most basic level is your brain asking a muscle to be less tense.

                      The sensation in your frenulum is probably related to the bulbocavernosus reflex (BCR). There are other ways to stimulate the BCR including firm pressure to the shaft and stimulation around the urethral opening. I seem to have to slowly downregulate each separate cause of the reflex.

                      I've yet to find good evidence for how decreased muscle tone leads to decreased nerve firing. That's my theory about the cause of the numbing effect of RKs.
                      SoftMmoNoPreE
                      Senior Member
                      Last edited by SoftMmoNoPreE; 02-23-2017, 02:14 AM.
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                      • #12
                        Well I'm sure I'm Alittle insane, and the first was a interesting read....
                        This!
                        "The pressure variations exerted on the glans during coitus by the perivaginal musculature are sufficient to induce ""reflex contractions"" of the ischiocavernosus muscles, promoting penile rigidity."

                        The frenulum, we I stroke or touch it I feel a weak spasm in the BC( taint) area. I assumed these spasm were a Weak IK. I was hoping it was a normal reflex for because the fernelum was the trigger!! It's just the body's way of keeping the penis stiff haha.
                        Thank you that answered my question from like January lol.

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                        • #13
                          That spasm was the reason I used such force to bear down on myself, was the only way to prevent what I thought was a IK.

                          I wonder if this was the synchronized kegal MM talked about?
                          Had a post about synchronized and asynchronized kegals, I never got to read it over thoroughly.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Polyorchid View Post
                            Well I'm sure I'm Alittle insane, and the first was a interesting read....
                            This!
                            "The pressure variations exerted on the glans during coitus by the perivaginal musculature are sufficient to induce ""reflex contractions"" of the ischiocavernosus muscles, promoting penile rigidity."

                            The frenulum, we I stroke or touch it I feel a weak spasm in the BC( taint) area. I assumed these spasm were a Weak IK. I was hoping it was a normal reflex for because the fernelum was the trigger!! It's just the body's way of keeping the penis stiff haha.
                            Thank you that answered my question from like January lol.
                            That is an IK. IKs should be distinguished by muscle affected. All IKs are not necessarily bad.

                            IC IKs are needed for 10/10 EQ. Don't think they contribute to taking me to PONR. The third link talks about this.

                            BC IKs take me quickly to PONR. Your body wants you to ejaculate so it can spread it's genes into the next generation so all ejaculations are not bad. BC IKs are a sign that its time to trigger orgasm. While you aren't MMO all your orgasms are ejaculatory which is a shame.

                            You want to decrease your BC IKs while maintaining your IC IKs.

                            The second link says "BC may be considered the "muscle of ejaculation," and IC the "muscle of erection."" Im gonna add that the LA is the "muscle of hard MMO"
                            SoftMmoNoPreE
                            Senior Member
                            Last edited by SoftMmoNoPreE; 02-23-2017, 02:31 PM.
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                            • #15
                              Question

                              6. What do you think IKs are? Are they bad?
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