Pau yuen tong question

[Tooners88]

Right, I was missing a step in the equation. Same basic logic though - the dick doesn’t signal the brain, therefore the brain doesn’t signal the BC to contract. The feedback “hose” gets kinked along its normal path.

If you stimulate the trigger zone normally then you’ll feel the BC contract and relax on each stroke (put a couple fingers there) whereas when the balm is applied it will no longer react. One research studied (and albeit sketchy) treatment for pre-e is to inject the BC muscle with Botox to stop it from contracting. There's probably more to it but I think the BC contractions are central to the whole equation. I mean, that's how kegels/reverse kegels work I would presume - you force the BC into either a fully stretched or fully flexed position so that it can't actively alternate back and forth between the two. (Or perhaps this is just common knowledge and I'm repeating things)

Interesting though because that’s exactly what I was telling myself during sex - that my dick and brain literally felt disconnected from eachother. Not in a bad way... I can still feel the sensations, but they almost feel "separate" from me in some way. And in both directions too - I can think sexual thoughts that would normally set me off instantly, but it’s like they just don’t travel down from my head to my dick.

Anyway hope your next session goes as well as the first - keep us posted.

Also, would you mind sharing your K/RK routine that allowed you to gain this level of control?

[Johnny D]

Right, I was missing a step in the equation. Same basic logic though - the dick doesn’t signal the brain, therefore the brain doesn’t signal the BC to contract. The feedback “hose” gets kinked along its normal path.

If you stimulate the trigger zone normally then you’ll feel the BC contract and relax on each stroke (put a couple fingers there) whereas when the balm is applied it will no longer react. One research studied (and albeit sketchy) treatment for pre-e is to inject the BC muscle with Botox to stop it from contracting. There's probably more to it but I think the BC contractions are central to the whole equation. I mean, that's how kegels/reverse kegels work I would presume - you force the BC into either a fully stretched or fully flexed position so that it can't actively alternate back and forth between the two. (Or perhaps this is just common knowledge and I'm repeating things)

Interesting though because that’s exactly what I was telling myself during sex - that my dick and brain literally felt disconnected from eachother. Not in a bad way... I can still feel the sensations, but they almost feel "separate" from me in some way. And in both directions too - I can think sexual thoughts that would normally set me off instantly, but it’s like they just don’t travel down from my head to my dick.

Anyway hope your next session goes as well as the first - keep us posted.

Also, would you mind sharing your K/RK routine that allowed you to gain this level of control?

I don't have a routine. A few years ago, when I first learned about benefits of kegels for men, I had a routine. Something like a minute of 1s contractions, a minute of 5s, a min of 10s, etc... At first I would spend maybe 10 minutes each day doing them. And I'd find other routines and add them in. Plus, when I'd be driving I might do a bunch of long contractions, too. Then I read about RK's and would do something similar but that was more recently. Now I don't have a routine, really. I don't do K's much, if any, but I will do a bunch of RK's in the mornings before the gym and then I pretty much do them all day long when I'm thinking of it. Anytime I become aware that my PF is contracted, I'll RK. I manually brew my coffee every morning and hold long RK's the entire time, etc... Just sort of whenever, I guess. I don't know how convinced I am about an RK routine. Awareness is the most important part for me, I think. I'm 50 and, while I've been sexually active since a teenager, I only recently became aware of the IK's during sex. Getting in touch with my PF and understanding how to control it makes a big difference. That doesn't mean that I necessarily can control the IK's during sex but I'm very aware of what's happening and how to mitigate it. Arousal awareness is perhaps more important - learning what my levels are, etc... But I keep doing the RK's so I can continue to create a stronger connection between my mind and what's going on down below.

[Chief3nick]

So I used this product last night and was pretty impressed. I put a coated index finger worth around the frenulum and glans. Then got a tad more on my finger to really coat the whole area.

After about two hours, I washed it off and then edged into a flashlight with porn. It was a bit hard to get an erection, but I got there eventually and EQ was 6-8 most of the time. Did I put too much on or not wait long enough? I definitely felt the burning while it was applied.

I edged hard and fast to porn for twenty minutes and felt the PONR way off in the distance and had good sensitivity, just no feeling of cum already in my balls and ready to go. My PF was relaxed and I wasn’t hypersensitive. It was amazing!

I’m hoping to fine tune it and combine it with my routine to hopefully not have to use it forever but this is an encouraging start. Any usage tips are appreciated.

[DJchitown]

Ok last night I took a long hot bath in Epson Salt and around 20 minutes of getting out I applied some balm around the entire head of my penis and just below. I would say that around 15 minutes I felt a tingling burning sensation. I didn't feel it on the three previous applications of the balm. It actually felt uncomfortable similar to the feeling one gets when he puts cologne on his nuts (yeah you remember). I left it on there and around an hour later I began to masturbate to some porn. It was hard to get an erection (also I have ED and use Trimix) but I got erect and lost my erection. I masturbated for over an hour with a lot of fast strokes and several times had precum but didn't ejaculate. I didn't have the same sensitivity to my penis as I would without the balm but I could still feel some mild sensation.

I know that I used more than the recommended amount but I think applying it to the head and trying to avoid the opening to the urethra because it may burn. I am going to try it again using a hot towel on the penis and then using Trimix too.

I know some people suggest wiping it off so that the lover doesn't taste it or possibly have a negative reaction to it but I think best to keep it on at least 30 minutes after one feels the "tingling" sensation.

I have to find a methodology that works so that if/when someone insists on giving me the pussy I can walk in there with confidence knowing that with the Trimix and the PYT balm. I will rock the pussy good enough for her to ask me to come by again.

[Chief3nick]

What do we think the tingling is? The desensitizing effect? I’d like to get together some more hypotheses about why it works and see what training we can do to train to get that desired effect.

I tried SSRIs for 8 weeks with no luck and this actually works whereas that didn’t. What could that mean?

[Johnny D]

What do we think the tingling is? The desensitizing effect? I’d like to get together some more hypotheses about why it works and see what training we can do to train to get that desired effect.

I tried SSRIs for 8 weeks with no luck and this actually works whereas that didn’t. What could that mean?

It might simply mean that your primary issue is hyper-sensitivity. Some people are extremely ticklish in certain areas while others aren't ticklish at all. Perhaps your penile nerves are easily stimulated - considerably more than others. The training for that would be to continue stimulating the sensitive area to the point where you can handle it. In the meantime, PYT can mitigate the issue for you. That's what I suspect.

I know 3 people who have hyper-sensitive belly buttons. If you so much as lay a finger on it, they freak out. 2 of them say that it makes them feel like peeing immediately! I know one person who is incredibly ticklish on her forearm - sometimes with an erotic response. The notion that all men's penises have the same sensitivity level, and the true problem is arousal level or pelvic tension or poorly trained BC response or something like that, is unfounded. In fact, some men have fewer nerves in their penis than others. There's no reason to believe that the issue isn't purely one of physical sensitivity. If that's the case, you can work to desensitize the trigger points and you can work to control your response to stimulation, the way you might with pain.

[Tooners88]

So I used this product last night and was pretty impressed. I put a coated index finger worth around the frenulum and glans. Then got a tad more on my finger to really coat the whole area.

After about two hours, I washed it off and then edged into a flashlight with porn. It was a bit hard to get an erection, but I got there eventually and EQ was 6-8 most of the time. Did I put too much on or not wait long enough? I definitely felt the burning while it was applied.

I edged hard and fast to porn for twenty minutes and felt the PONR way off in the distance and had good sensitivity, just no feeling of cum already in my balls and ready to go. My PF was relaxed and I wasn’t hypersensitive. It was amazing!

I’m hoping to fine tune it and combine it with my routine to hopefully not have to use it forever but this is an encouraging start. Any usage tips are appreciated.

Awesome - the success rate with this stuff seems to be very consistent.

Not sure if you applied to the entire glans but if so then next time just do the frenulum and underside of the glans - leave the top side alone. The underside is the trigger zone and perhaps leaving the rest of the glans alone might help a bit with the EQ.

It does take some testing to find the right amount - I'm still working on it myself.

[Tooners88]

What do we think the tingling is? The desensitizing effect? I’d like to get together some more hypotheses about why it works and see what training we can do to train to get that desired effect.

I tried SSRIs for 8 weeks with no luck and this actually works whereas that didn’t. What could that mean?

I think it's fairly straightforward. The balm simply shuts off the signal from the trigger zone to the brain by desensitizing the nerves. The brain literally doesn't know that the area is being stimulated (or at least, it's only receiving a fraction of the signal). And I believe at least one of the primary mechanisms at play is that this prevents the brain from activating the BC muscle, as the contractions of that muscle are what stimulate the ejaculation process. (This is why reverse kegels help and why tensing the BC muscle during sex or masturbation makes you cum quicker)

So, the key training method here as far as I see it would be to work on manually desensitizing the frenulum/underside of the glans to create the same effect without needing the balm. This is a "controversial" method of course... I don't know what the best way to go about doing it would be (hands, cloth, vibrator etc.) or to what extent it can be manually desensitized in the first place. It's something I'm currently experimenting with though. Aside from just assessing the decrease in sensitivity by feel, another way to measure how successfully it's working is to feel if the BC contractions are quieting down over time when the area is stimulated. (I read a thread on another forum of a guy who cured his severe pre-e and he says that over time by consistently stimulating his trigger points the BC muscle stopped reacting to it)

[Tooners88]

It might simply mean that your primary issue is hyper-sensitivity. Some people are extremely ticklish in certain areas while others aren't ticklish at all. Perhaps your penile nerves are easily stimulated - considerably more than others. The training for that would be to continue stimulating the sensitive area to the point where you can handle it. In the meantime, PYT can mitigate the issue for you. That's what I suspect.

Yep, many people scoff at this idea as being some sort of "excuse" and I can't understand why. It's a perfectly plausible theory and there is even research that supports it. The fact that temporarily desensitizing a small bundle of penile nerves can instantly take someone from cumming in 20 seconds to pounding away for 10+ minutes is pretty damn good evidence of the role that sensitivity plays in the whole equation.

I agree on the training part too and we need guys who are willing to try this out to test some different methods so we can figure out what the best approach for it is. I've played around using my hands, a cloth and a vibrator but I think it really takes time to see results with this. Of course we have to be careful as well to ensure that it doesn't lead to any issues with EQ.

[Chief3nick]

Awesome - the success rate with this stuff seems to be very consistent.

Not sure if you applied to the entire glans but if so then next time just do the frenulum and underside of the glans - leave the top side alone. The underside is the trigger zone and perhaps leaving the rest of the glans alone might help a bit with the EQ.

It does take some testing to find the right amount - I'm still working on it myself.

Yes I did cover the top glans as well so I will try a little less and only on the bottom. Cumming fast is a lesser evil than ED.

The decreased sensitivity makes a lot of sense as to why I can’t progress very far. I’ve made strides in the past 18 months with flexibility, lower body health, reverse kegels, PONR awareness, and arousal control but I simply can’t get to where I need to be. Could this sensitivity be a limiting factor? I’ve been with a pelvic floor PT for 6 months and started of somewhat tight and weak but have progressed in that area as well as confirmed by a biofeedback test that was night and day from the first one I took with her.

So with where my body is, I still don’t think I should be pounding for 20 minutes straight but it shouldn’t be 75 seconds either. I don’t have crazy IKs I just put it in, have the feeling that cum is already up in my testicles, and soon after the PONR comes like a ton of bricks.

SSRIs didn’t help me which leads me back to the hypersensitivity issue. We might be on to something. I absolutely believe in the PF, srousal control, and other highly thought of things on this site, but there is no way 70% of the earth in this day and age has a balanced PF. I have a 300 pound friend with no flexibility and in horrid shape that has never heard of a pelvic floor and he can last a long time. There has to be more to it. I’ll be exploring this option while continuing RK, Hindi, etc.