Opinion. Too much emphasis on RK isolation for beginners

**Spoonman84** · 01-24-2020

Over the years I seen thread after thread of people struggling with RK and usually coming down to them not able to feel them, and struggling with isolation. Especially front reverse kegel. So this is what helped me the most.

This is just my opinion from my personal experience and the few people I helped over the years. I believe reverse kegel is much more effective doing both front and back simultaneously. I feel they work in synergy together and are much more powerful together than separate and greatly enhances the stretch of the pelvic floor. I believe constant emphasis on isolation slows downs ones progress, and I feel this would greatly benefit beginners who are always struggling to feel it .I see a constant emphasis on front isolation, as most people only have front tightness and then don't see a need for back, because that's not a problem area . And to be frank people are afraid they will shit themselves and fart during practice /sex.

I struggled for a long time like others to do isolation and was always weak, until I started doing them together. That made the biggest difference in my ability to push away involuntary kegels A LOT more easily, achieve isolation, and loosening pelvic floor with RK . Now that I can isolate just fine, and got I pretty good with it, I never do them because it's still, for me, just not as powerful as simultaneously front and back. This isn't an argument against achieving isolation, or working at it because it does have its own benefits, just feel personally a lot can be gained by doing them together over separate.

**Spoonman84** · 01-24-2020

I forgot to mention what lead me to this conclusion and path was reading over time , most people can't do true full isolation. Sure some can, but even with mastery there is usually some engagement of back when doing front and vice versa. it made me think because of that engagement during isolation, the other part is always trying be able to assist or expand as well.

**ACPreE** · 01-24-2020

During practice you can certainly isolate the most problem areas, which a lot of the time is the front. RKs definitely take some progression steps to achieve a more well rounded feeling of the area. Stretching and constant practice doing RKs help build that overall. I think people try to jump in and go straight for isolation when in fact its more about just unlocking and stretching the area out in the beginning. Like I always say, it took me a month or so just to unlock my PF. Anyone who starts expecting to feel RKs or be able to isolate right off the bat are people who walk into a gym wanting to bench 200 but haven't tried just the bar yet.

Agree with your point.

**Pegasus** · 01-24-2020

My thought is that guys should start with together and work towards being able to isolate over time.

**Spoonman84** · 01-25-2020

AcePreE, I like that term you used. "unlockyour pelvic floor". And that's my take away people are having d struggling with feeling it. For me the simultaneous front and back RK is what did that for me, and hope maybe pushing that idea more will help people.

Slowgo I'll try and answer from my experience.

What you experienced is something I have experienced before, and believe there is overlap to front and back. I found back RK was being more effective to my tight front pelvic floor, than the standard front RK. I'm not sure why, but I believe the back can produce MUCH more internal pressure bearing down on the whole pelvic floor versus the front . When you go deficate, it forces people to urinate,you can't stop it, but doesn't work the other way around. This why I feel doing the back greatly effects the front, but people don't think about that area since it's not the problem area. I believe training the back effects the front, and back effects the front, so I stop splitting them and doing them together.

1.Pegasus was right that back ones are rare. So you might, but also possible you dont, like me I didn't and back is more effective for you. Combining both for me was even more effective.

2. If that split works for you keep doing it.

3. I would absolutely keep playing with back RK and put emphasis on that if you are getting results.

**CaptainBlack** · 01-25-2020

first time to try , reversed front kegel was 1h ago
it was so hard to do and so hard to breath too ..
i hope i did it right

**Anthony_gerio** · 01-25-2020

I have been to a professional pelvic floor therapist who had a loads of experience people coming to him just for the tighten floor and the consequences on the PreE.

Just a personal opinion:
The emphasiz on RK is really to much in this forums and people waste their time that they could put on other training by doing RKs. Tight pelvic floor happens mostly in wemon or certain athletes. It is very rare to happen to people under 40 and males who are not doing certain sports or have not had injuries in that area. Even if you have overtrained your BS etc with a little bit of diaphragmic breathing it gets back to normal.
If you have a tight floor which is going to cause your PreE, you should also experience your flow of urine being cut more than once during peeing, very hard defication or mild to harsh pain in that area. Otherwise your pelvic floor is doing just fine.

However, you may involunteery engaging it while sex or masturbation by keeping the diapragm hard. Your back from neck to middle, the middle of your chest and your shoulders should not be tight during sex. Even if you push your teeth together (which is what we do if we are scared or stressed) it put pressure on your pelvic floor. I believe in order to overcome PreE, it helped me most when I addreessed these issues. Your focus should be more on improving confidence and relaxation other than RKs.
People try to focus on these during sex and automatically focusing on one part makes you stiff and hard on the neck, which makes your jaws to activate, makes your back to tighten up and it really doesn't help you.

Just now that you are reading this post, pay attention to your back and shoulders and see how cramped they are.

**Pegasus** · 01-25-2020

Umm Anthony g.
My reply to this .
Quote
Just a personal opinion:
The emphasiz on RK is really to much in this forums and people waste their time that they could put on other training by doing RKs. Tight pelvic floor happens mostly in wemon or certain athletes. It is very rare to happen to people under 40 and males who are not doing certain sports or have not had injuries in that area. Even if you have overtrained your BS etc with a little bit of diaphragmic breathing it gets back to normal.
If you have a tight floor which is going to cause your PreE, you should also experience your flow of urine being cut more than once during peeing, very hard defication or mild to harsh pain in that area. Otherwise your pelvic floor is doing just fine.
Unquote
Is a simple no.

**DickerSchwanz** · 01-25-2020

Just expand the whole area down and out in a 3D way.
Unless you can expand the whole area front, back, left, right at once as if a balloon is down there expanding .. isolations are ineffective.
Once you open the whole pelvic floor isolations are actually easy. If you do isolations with even 1 small Pf muscles chronically tense it will be ineffective.

I trained isolations while unknowingly being chronically tight and it was a PITA literally. Then I just opened up the whole area and isolations are easy. Ballooning my penis via front RK's.. Back RK's shifting PONR tension.. it almost comes naturally now.

**ACPreE** · 01-27-2020

Originally Posted by Anthony_gerio

I have been to a professional pelvic floor therapist who had a loads of experience people coming to him just for the tighten floor and the consequences on the PreE.

Just a personal opinion:
The emphasiz on RK is really to much in this forums and people waste their time that they could put on other training by doing RKs. Tight pelvic floor happens mostly in wemon or certain athletes. It is very rare to happen to people under 40 and males who are not doing certain sports or have not had injuries in that area. Even if you have overtrained your BS etc with a little bit of diaphragmic breathing it gets back to normal.
If you have a tight floor which is going to cause your PreE, you should also experience your flow of urine being cut more than once during peeing, very hard defication or mild to harsh pain in that area. Otherwise your pelvic floor is doing just fine.

However, you may involunteery engaging it while sex or masturbation by keeping the diapragm hard. Your back from neck to middle, the middle of your chest and your shoulders should not be tight during sex. Even if you push your teeth together (which is what we do if we are scared or stressed) it put pressure on your pelvic floor. I believe in order to overcome PreE, it helped me most when I addreessed these issues. Your focus should be more on improving confidence and relaxation other than RKs.
People try to focus on these during sex and automatically focusing on one part makes you stiff and hard on the neck, which makes your jaws to activate, makes your back to tighten up and it really doesn't help you.

Just now that you are reading this post, pay attention to your back and shoulders and see how cramped they are.

I'm going to have to agree to disagree. RKs and stretching the PF are a very big part and was a very big part in my recovery. Learning how to do RKs very well allowed me to retrain my PF not to hold tension and kegel 24/7. Though we shouldn't focus only on RKs but it is a necessary part to the recovery process.

When i started I couldn't do a RK at all because my PF was so tight. APT didnt help that either. Unlocking the PF to do RKs was my first breakthrough into reconditioning my PF to relax. Everyone is different but to those like me who had held a kegel during sex/masturbation, rushed masturbation and constantly held tension, RKs do hold weight.