Premature ejaculation coaches corner.

[Pegasus]

quote jm
It took hard training and lots of time to isolate and be able to do them without using too much abs.
Btw... I noticed that today when I do a hard reverse kegel as to stop ejaculation, I HAVE to use my lower abs or diaphragm. U
Unquote
So you are able to use isolation or combined action as required.
Rk Do requires a lot of rk strength, as stated before I really think you are using more skill than you give yourself credit for.
Hard wave rk mmo Is in your future ,talk to mv.

[JamesMonroe]

For most people the idea of pushing gives them the best idea of how to perform rk , just as you say push out a piss reather than relax out a piss. The feel might be more important than the science here.
Remember to build up condition before doing max contractions.

Absolutely... you have to be careful and go easy at first. That being said, I don't think anyone has ever injured themselves with a hard revesre kegel. If someone has, please let us know.

[Pegasus]

Absolutely... you have to be careful and go easy at first. That being said, I don't think anyone has ever injured themselves with a hard revesre kegel. If someone has, please let us know.

It can be done if you work hard at it . Same with extraemely rapid increase in volume.

[JamesMonroe]

quote jm
It took hard training and lots of time to isolate and be able to do them without using too much abs.
Btw... I noticed that today when I do a hard reverse kegel as to stop ejaculation, I HAVE to use my lower abs or diaphragm. U
Unquote
So you are able to use isolation or combined action as required.
Rk Do requires a lot of rk strength, as stated before I really think you are using more skill than you give yourself credit for.
Hard wave rk mmo Is in your future ,talk to mv.

Who's MV?
I don't think I isolate completely. Even if I do a soft slow relaxed "stretch", I still feel my abs tensing up a bit. When I do a hard long reverse kegel to stop ejac my abs still tense up a bit too. I think all people's abs tense up a bit when they do reverse kegels, even if they claim to be able to "isolate" them. For sure they are all still using the diaphram, because as we are all noticing and almost all agreeing on is that some sort of muscle or a combined group of muscles IS what causes the reverse kegel. It's either the pelvic diaphragm, the lower abs or something else.
We pretty much all disagree, but maybe also the PC muscle has a second opposite/pushing action/mechanism to it or whatever that causes the reverse kegel?
But that idea won't get very far since people believe its only one muscle that contracts only one way, like a bicep without a tricep. The only muscles that it could logicayl be are lower abs and or the pelvic diaphragm.

[Pegasus]

Low profile mmo exponent. View Profile: mvergasioin - PEGym Forums

[spanky]

I would add here for clarity that that anxiety is not just performance or surface sexual anxiety, and that underlying issues, stress, trust, depression and other unrelated concerns that as you say are not always easy to identify can be just as destructive.

Obviously this is only a potential part of the problem, but it's very real regardless of how elusive it might be to identify. I'm not saying that any stress in your life will cause PreE but I AM saying that if it affects your self belief and sense of self-worth at all, it CAN be.

my meditation and pranayama has been a major factor as well

Case in point Thanks, bigmoe

As for the arousal point... I agree... maybe thats why I can last long with my gf now. Like I said, now I'm used to her. What if I get with a new girl.... that might give me prem ejac again cuz of the new arousal levels. OR maybe ill he ok, cuz I have been trained well by now and I can handle high levels of arousal now.....

I'm totally confident that if/when you find yourself with a new girl you will only have psychological hurdles if you have any at all. Based on where you're coming from now, i.e. concerned about it, I think it may take you a little while to relax into a new woman, whereas if you were proudly asserting that you had it under control and saw sex with this new girl as an opportunity to blow her mind (which you would, of course), I think you'd be fine and have no problems at all. I don't have a list of hundreds of women in my past, but there have been quite a few, and in general, they all feel remarkably similar. Plus, I've had far more intense sensation from sex this year than ever so I stand by what I've said before that you're unlikely to be "over sensitive" and that it's arousal you need get used to. Which is psychological.

I mean think about it. If you're not in the mood but then start rubbing the most sensitive parts of your flaccid penis, you may recoil, but you're really really unlikely to blow right then and there because your arousal is at a 0. Meanwhile you can also have wet dreams and blow without even touching yourself.

.....Any time you move ANY part of your body, including fingers and eyeballs, it's a muscle, not a stretch.

So wouldn't it be flexing and not just stretching. My reasoning is that you need to flex something to be able to stretch something.

I don't particularly want to add fuel to the semantic fire here, but for me, overcoming involuntary kegels felt like a process of relaxation and while it's not something I need to concentrate on any more I distinctly remember a conscious mental process of resistance such that at times the energy that was destined to contract my BC involuntarily would instead dissipate outwards with a tingle. Not an unpleasant sensation, but not one of contraction or fitness. In retrospect this would have been a very gentle RK I'm sure, which is of course a gentle hold of competing muscles, but I wasn't flexing or building up strength as such, I was asserting conscious control and refusing to relax that muscle such that my autonomic reflexes couldn't engage so easily. Point being that this wasn't a movement, although I accept that there may well have been the gentlest active tension of competing muscles in play to support it.

Just thinking about the science a little actually, with regards to involuntaries, involuntary twitching of any muscle ought to be overcome with tone and fitness of that muscle. Certainly weak muscles anywhere in your body are more prone to involuntary contraction, so perhaps the most effective contributory part of overcoming involuntary BC contractions is to work the BC with a good forward Kegel routine rather than RKs? Just a thought.

This is far more semantic than scientific as an argument anyway, and as Pegasus as said, the science isn't necessarily relevant. We can talk about flexors and tensors, smooth and striated muscle etc (remember your penis is mostly muscle too) but does it matter? What's important is that we can teach self-awareness and ability to respond, not building strength. Point is that arousal is about sensuality, not strength, which is why
a) fucking a woman like a jackhammer isn't likely to give her the orgasm of her life and
b) most of us here have cum too soon and it didn't even feel that great.

Something I want to add to the conversation though. Maybe this was just me, but I mentioned Barbara Keeslings Peaking exercises in my "everything" post, and I tell you what, that was one of the most productive and helpful exercises I took on at the time. Certainly as far as self-awareness goes. I'm just surprised they're not mentioned or cited more here, as a few months of practising these really did help me out a LOT.

[spanky]

To everyone here who's overcome PreE and/or coaches, you know we may be in danger of being able to write a pretty damned good book on this subject soon

[bigmoe5067]

To everyone here who's overcome PreE and/or coaches, you know we may be in danger of being able to write a pretty damned good book on this subject soon

im sure it will happen eventually. the amount of substance and experience and theory is vast. it would take much sifting, and some serious motivation (something we all seem to have on here). if people were willing to add their experiences from coaches as means of validation from different scenarios, it could make said book very legitmate

[imac]

yes.... Like iMac says.... I also do light relaxing pushes/stretches to keep relaxed and keep spasms and PONRs at bay, but I think both him and I have and agree that we have stregthened that area over time, weather one of us pushed harder than the other doesn't matter. I think we both strenghened the lower abs/diaphragm or whatever is enabling us to PUSH well, down there.

Muscles can't stretch by themselves, I've never said they could. It's true that muscles can relax by themselves but not stretch by themselves, a stretch requires some sort of leverage or opposing movement.
Let me try explain what I'm talking about as best I can.
The pelvic floor muscles are always in a state of tension to some degree, If they weren't then we'd all be incontinent.
So what I do is if I'm doing a front reverse kegel then I keep the tension in the back of my pelvic floor (but NOT doing a back kegel) and I use that as my leverage to push forward and if I need to apply extra force then I use my diaphragm to apply extra pressure.
If I'm doing a back reverse kegel I do the opposite. Perhaps that's the reason why I've never liked doing reverse kegels as a group.

You know trying to find the right words to explain what I'm trying to say is a pain in the ass.

[imac]

I think the confusion is that people call the reverse kegel a muscle. I agree that it's not and that some kind of muscle or muscle are causing a reverse kegel to work. Does THAT make sense now....
I must admit, I too thought that the reverse kegel was a muscle. Or that the same muscle (PC is it?) that makes a regular kegel possible was the same one flexing the opposite way acting as a reverse kegel. What if the PC muscle has 2 parts or just one part with 2 actions that enables it to flex both ways???
But I don't believe that.... I think it's the diaphragm maybe helped with other muscles like the lower abs or whatever.

The PC muscle can only flex one way. All of the pelvic floor muscles are designed in a way that they can only contract in and up so that they can provide better support for your internal organs.