The “Average Overall Arousal” Theory (AOA)

[Minuteman]

I'm feeling positive about this. If you don't masturbate much or not at all for 4 months you could technically reset everything. Think when you was a kid and you learnt the bad masturbation habits that caused your PE in the first place, by not doing anything (or hardly anything) for a good while your body could potentially calm down and you could start over. Saying that i feel as if old habits may not be forgotten just like for example the way no matter how long you don't ride a bike it comes back to you straight away

It doesn't work like that for people with long history of premature ejaculation problems. I have had pauses in mastubation (and edging, and everything sexually) for more than a month several times, when you string a certain period you can say that I had 4 months of not much mastubation at all.

Some degree of reset can be achieved but the problem is that for most the habbits (both physical and psychological) are so deep rooted that no amount of rest time will bring it back.

How ever pelvic balance can be achieved to some point if you take a break, I tend to classify this as a low level balance. Low level balance means that if you introduce anything (be it kegels or reverse kegels) it will affect your balance more extremly because your are not conditioned enough. For most people low level balance is really all they need to last forever since they didn't have any bad habits and predispositions. On other had if you have predispositions to have premature ejaculation, or stressful environment that affects you in a way that causes premature ejaculation, or just bad habits that take time to be changed then you should strave for high level balance that is brought on by conditioning your pelvic floor via a kegel routine.

That doesn't mean that 1-2 months (or even 3 months) of detox from porn and decreased mastubation will not help you. Also if the premature ejaculation problems started to occur latter in your life (or you had a 4-5, even a year bad period recently) then the 4 months break will probably help you in a way you described, it would even be better if during that time one start yoga, or go to a fitness club or gym, to try and replace any bad habits it may have formed.

[Drummer19]

It doesn't work like that for people with long history of premature ejaculation problems. I have had pauses in mastubation (and edging, and everything sexually) for more than a month several times, when you string a certain period you can say that I had 4 months of not much mastubation at all.

Some degree of reset can be achieved but the problem is that for most the habbits (both physical and psychological) are so deep rooted that no amount of rest time will bring it back.

That doesn't mean that 1-2 months (or even 3 months) of detox from porn and decreased mastubation will not help you. Also if the premature ejaculation problems started to occur latter in your life (or you had a 4-5, even a year bad period recently) then the 4 months break will probably help you in a way you described, it would even be better if during that time one start yoga, or go to a fitness club or gym, to try and replace any bad habits it may have formed.

I need people with a long history of premature ejaculation to try this so we can have proof that it does or doesn't work. And then another thing we have to test is someone with a long history of pre-e that has done arousal training before and has already started to reverse bad habits try this too. Until I have had both groups of people try this out I can't credit nor discredit this theory.

No matter how deep-rooted a habit is, your mind can reroute to another habit with dedication and practice. So going back to the habits that brought upon Pre-E are still there and still strong if you would ever revert back to these habits. (That was partially for your response too, Nibbles.)

I am sure that the longer you have dealt with Pre-E the longer it would take to overcome Pre-E, but I do believe anyone can overcome it with dedication. I had Pre-E with partners for 4 years already. I would guess I could add another 3 years for the time that I would masturbate under 1 min and ejaculate. That is 7 years of Pre-E I fixed, which is a decent amount of time. How many years of Pre-E did JamesMonroe have?

It would be a great idea to find a new hobby or spend time in an area of improvement! This has many psychological benefits that would make changing bad habits easier.

Overall great response Minuteman but we can't say this doesn't work until someone tries it and proves it. And I really need more people from different experiences of Pre-E to try this out (as well as the arousal techniques) so that I can get some conclusions going.

[nibbles]

Would no masturbation (or one session every two weeks) along side reverse kegels and possibly relaxation techniques possibly have a better outcome? I know we haven't yet tested but reverse kegels will not have anything to do with lowering arousal therefore we could strengthen out reverse kegels whilst hopefully lowering our arousal with this proposed method. The outcome could be that we struggle to ejaculate at all but we've successfully made it to the complete opposite side from where we started (ejaculating prematurely). We can then integrate the techniques (such as regular kegels) to get back a balance.

I feel it would be easier to get to a good balance in-between if we got on the opposite side from where we started (struggling to ejaculate/overpowering reverse kegel) because we already know the methods that got us to PE in the first place for example overpowering kegels/masturbating to high arousal material. That way we'd hopefully lower arousal through this method, gain overpowering reverse kegels that could cause a "Low level balance" (as Minuteman likes to call it) and then start a regular kegel heavy routine until we are happy with how long we last.

Does that make any sense? I don't know if i explained that very well

[Drummer19]

Would no masturbation (or one session every two weeks) along side reverse kegels and possibly relaxation techniques possibly have a better outcome? I know we haven't yet tested but reverse kegels will not have anything to do with lowering arousal therefore we could strengthen out reverse kegels whilst hopefully lowering our arousal with this proposed method. The outcome could be that we struggle to ejaculate at all but we've successfully made it to the complete opposite side from where we started (ejaculating prematurely). We can then integrate the techniques (such as regular kegels) to get back a balance.

I feel it would be easier to get to a good balance in-between if we got on the opposite side from where we started (struggling to ejaculate/overpowering reverse kegel) because we already know the methods that got us to PE in the first place for example overpowering kegels/masturbating to high arousal material. That way we'd hopefully lower arousal through this method, gain overpowering reverse kegels that could cause a "Low level balance" (as Minuteman likes to call it) and then start a regular kegel heavy routine until we are happy with how long we last.

Does that make any sense? I don't know if i explained that very well

The original purpose was to see if complete abstaination from all techniques physical or mental would bring down your arousal. This was so that your mind and body would both take a break from everything sexually related.

If you would like to, go ahead and try your route and let me know how it goes. If this works then we will know that doing reverse kegals and relaxation techniques while doing this will work out fine.

Have you been doing the reverse kegals, and relaxation techniques for a while now? If so, what were your results so far? it would be better for you if you have been doing this for a while now, as continuing these wouldn't obscure the results so much.

[gettingb]

This thread is very interesting.

I am 29 years old, I have suffered from PE pretty much as long as I can remember. In fact my earliest memories would be of ballooning for hours when I was 11-12 years old just to enjoy the feeling. It freaked me the fuck out when I first ejaculated. After this I discovered I could rush to ejaculation by tensing my pelvic floor muscles (although I didn't know what I was doing at the time), and ejaculate probably 7 + times to the point there was no semen left to come out. When I first had girl friends my arousal was controllable but I would ejaculate quickly during sex. This got worse over the years, I had some success with drink and drugs but in recent years I have been watching porn, getting aroused very quickly and ejaculating as quickly as possible. Often within seconds. This lead to very bad problems with my girlfriend, I would get aroused very quickly, leak large amounts of pre cum and start getting erect if I thought there was even a slim possibility of sex or we were kissing etc. When having sex I would cum in seconds, with the use of marijuana I could sometimes last longer.
I had a period of a month or so where something 'clicked' and I could last as long as I wanted (albeit having used marijuana before hand). But this soon went away as I didn't know how I achieved it and I'm sure I went back to porn and quick ejaculation.
A year or 2 ago I noticed my pelvic floor was very unbalanced and tense all the time. I assume this is from years of conditioning myself to cum quickly. Even if a girl would try chatting me up or making her intentions clear I would get pre cum. I would have involuntary spasms when hugging my girl in bed.

So I have been following advice from this forum, also Barbara Keesling and Mantak Chia's book. I have noticed some very interesting things so far!
I have been trying a kegel routine, and my pelvic floor is becoming much more balanced. Before I only tried normal kegels and this didn't help as I was already very tense. Now I can quickly recognise when I am tense and relax my pelvic floor. But still a way from becoming perfectly balanced and strong. I can now isolate PC muscle from all stomach muscles, but still it's a challenge to isolate from BC muscle.

I have been edging/balooning with lube. At first I did this every day for about 2 weeks. Concentrating on avoiding involuntary PC spasms. It's going well, I can edge for an extended period of time in a variety of positions but I still don't have 100% control. For now, I plan to do these sessions most days when possible. I don't ejaculate if I can help it. I have had few wet dreams after not having any for a long time. I have had 1-2 retrograde ejaculations as I have tried DO without being properly conditioned. I know I am rushing this at times because I am overly enthusiastic - something I need to work on.

Things I have noticed:
My penis is actually much bigger than I thought, and my erection much harder.
I can now control arousal much better around my girl.
It takes me maybe 10 minutes to get a 8-9 erection when edging, not too sure if this is cause for concern?
I am much more confident in general and women react a lot differently around me
I am able to 'enjoy the moment' a lot more in all aspects of life
After I had a DO, my vision seems much sharper and everything looks more detailed
Deep belly breathing is hugely beneficial for control and relaxation
I have more energy, exercise seems more effective (i.e can build muscle mass more easily than before)
Keeping arousal level lower than erection level is effective?

But I haven't had sex for about 5 weeks so I can't comment on that!

I am interested in helping in this thread but as I am seeing positive results from the edging sessions I don't want to stop at the moment. I have cut out all porn, occasionally I look at pictures of women to see how my arousal reacts.

Sometimes it feels there are so many variables, it can be slightly confusing. But for now - kegel routines, arousal control and edging/ballooning practice. But I now realise it is so important to pace yourself!

[JamesMonroe]

I didn't start lasting longer until I stopped all masturbation, edging and exercises. I was just having real sex and trying to get used to that.

When i say "last longer", I mean during real sex. Even with a balanced pelvic floor and being able to edge for an hour, I still wasn't able to last longer during real sex. It wasn't till I stopped all exercises, edging, masturbating and started slowly getting used to only real sex with a patient, caring woman that I started lasting longer at real sex.

[MarcusHa]

Interesting post, gettingb.

How could you isolate reverse kegels from other abs muscles so fast?

[Drummer19]

Things I have noticed:
My penis is actually much bigger than I thought, and my erection much harder.
I can now control arousal much better around my girl.
It takes me maybe 10 minutes to get a 8-9 erection when edging, not too sure if this is cause for concern?
I am much more confident in general and women react a lot differently around me
I am able to 'enjoy the moment' a lot more in all aspects of life
After I had a DO, my vision seems much sharper and everything looks more detailed
Deep belly breathing is hugely beneficial for control and relaxation
I have more energy, exercise seems more effective (i.e can build muscle mass more easily than before)
Keeping arousal level lower than erection level is effective?

But I haven't had sex for about 5 weeks so I can't comment on that!

I am interested in helping in this thread but as I am seeing positive results from the edging sessions I don't want to stop at the moment. I have cut out all porn, occasionally I look at pictures of women to see how my arousal reacts.

Sometimes it feels there are so many variables, it can be slightly confusing. But for now - kegel routines, arousal control and edging/ballooning practice. But I now realise it is so important to pace yourself!

It sounds like you are going in the right direction! You should definitely continue to do what you are doing. In the meantime, master the understanding of your arousal by learning the steps on the "Arousal Techniques" sticky. If you ever run into a pitfall and find yourself going nowhere's come and try this.

[gettingb]

Interesting post, gettingb.

How could you isolate reverse kegels from other abs muscles so fast?

Firstly, I'm sure I still have a way to go and I have noticed that my pelvic floor is still not balanced correctly so I have decided to try more reverse kegels.

What helped with the isolation - since I have had a lot more energy from not ejaculating - I have been doing abdominal exercises everyday. I think this means either the muscles are more tired hence don't contract, or I have better control over the deeper lying abdominal muscles (I'm doing very slow crunch type exercises). Also I standing up can help to isolate reverse kegel, and sometimes trying a strong front kegel then relaxing right down into a reverse kegel.

I do notice that I still have a twinge of inbalance right down at the bottom of the muscle, so this is what I will focus on.

Interestingly, I notice that I have to ensure I'm mentally aroused enough to get a strong erection, but this arousal is much harder to control at the higher levels! High arousal also triggers kegels?


Learning something new everyday.

[Kekewak]

I would happily apply for this, reverse kegel (even tho i never got to feel that i made them right) and normals kegels didnt work for me about 1 year ago, so i went into some sort of depression of porn (I watched porn almost everyday), i really need a change in my habits, and if they will help with my pe, so be it. I need this and so all the girls i'll eventually bang. Where do I sign.

By the way, is there any way i can keep exercises? i know you want no arousal, but I could ceirtanly kegel and rkegel without an erection.

On the other poart i want to make a share for this post, It really happens than when you stop watching porn and masturbating every day, and u get to masturbate like once a week, your needs change, I forgot about the existance of porn and the need for climax, but I didnt felt any change in my PE, Except for the well being sensation, wich I also get when I'm having good days and I'm relaxed. I hope there is a way to prove that sustain low arousal over time helps.