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  • Physical stimulation and pelvic floor contractions - a stubborn problem

    I have a serious problem that I think is the main reason for my PE.

    I'm not sure if it is the normal physiological reaction or if it is an association I created, but whenever I have physical stimulation - I have contraction in my pelvic floor muscle.
    This is the way my body react - I mostly don't even notice I contract the muscle, I only feel it when I stop the stimulation and have the relaxation of the muscle. What I mean is this:
    I put my hand on my BC muscle(few fingers between my balls and anus+my thumb on the upper part of my penis where the penis attached to the body), and whenever I "stroke" the muscle is contracting. As soon as I stop the stimulation, the muscle relax.
    So if I do 1 stroke(or just up or down) - the muscle contract, and as soon as I stop - the muscle get relaxed. If I keep stroking, the muscle stay contracted until I stop - and then it relaxes.
    When I get close to the PONR I also get a "rhythmic" spasm(fast "pulsing") in the lower part of my BC muscle(closer to the anus).

    I tried relaxing the area mentally(it doesn't help), I tried RK(the contraction goes "over" the RK), and everything else I can think of.
    At times after I edge for more than 15 minutes, if I go REALLY slow, and stay VERY focused on relaxing, I can get it to not contract and then I feel I can keep going(i,e I have control). But sometimes it doesn't work even in such circumstances.

    I do my FK/FRK/BK/BRK routine(following Minuteman plan on his dry orgasm thread), along with extra tennis ball massage for relaxation. I am not in a very good shape yet - but defiantly not in a bad one as well.

    I'm not sure how to proceed, i.e. how to break this connection.
    It seems like it is my body automatic respond to physical stimulation. It feels like trying to not automatically "remove" my hand when getting burn from hot oven.


    Can anyone help?

  • #2
    Practice this technique.

    https://www.pegym.com/forums/prematu...se-kegels.html
    On a break from the forum
    imac's Phallosan Forte Progress Log
    Pelvic Floor Balance
    Confusion With Reverse Kegels

    Reverse Kegel Breathing (Meditative Reverse Kegels)

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by imac View Post
      The issue is that this contraction to physical stimulation became a reflex.
      This is so strong that even when I do HARD RK(not light like in your technique), the contraction get over the RK.

      Also, this happen on every stroke as I explain. So it's the way my body react to physical stimulation which is probably why it is so hard to learn not to do - I need to re-wire my body somehow

      Comment


      • #4
        Which is why I suggested that technique because it's all about making a new habit/reflex by connecting your breathing with a relaxed pelvic floor.

        If you want to form a new habit then you need to practice practice practice before you're able to do something without thinking.
        How Long to Form a Habit? ? PsyBlog
        On a break from the forum
        imac's Phallosan Forte Progress Log
        Pelvic Floor Balance
        Confusion With Reverse Kegels

        Reverse Kegel Breathing (Meditative Reverse Kegels)

        Comment


        • #5
          bbxer, I have been very concerned about that issue too. When it comes to this tension, things haven't really improved since I started edging and reverse kegeling.

          But I guess it takes time to replace a habit. Surely the maintaining contraction is less strong by now. For reducing the tension on the pelvic floor area, try the pillow stretch and yoga poses!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by imac View Post
            Which is why I suggested that technique because it's all about making a new habit/reflex by connecting your breathing with a relaxed pelvic floor.

            If you want to form a new habit then you need to practice practice practice before you're able to do something without thinking.
            How Long to Form a Habit? ? PsyBlog
            I will give it a try, it can't hurt for sure

            The reason I think it won't solve the problem is that this technique synchronize breathing with relaxed pelvic floor.
            I can't synchronize breathing(slow breathing) with "thrusting". Maybe I can in edging, but not in real sex when the tempo is faster. And the bottom line is sex.
            Also, even if I could relax the pelvic floor when I inhale, as soon as I exhale I will get contraction(this is the case on some of the times when I can partly relax the area).

            Anything else you(or anyone else) can suggest? Again, its about breaking the connection between physical stimulation and pelvic floor contraction - which became a reflex for me(maybe it's normal, i'm not sure).

            Thanks

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by MarcusHa View Post
              bbxer, I have been very concerned about that issue too. When it comes to this tension, things haven't really improved since I started edging and reverse kegeling.

              But I guess it takes time to replace a habit. Surely the maintaining contraction is less strong by now. For reducing the tension on the pelvic floor area, try the pillow stretch and yoga poses!
              I really feel like this is the key. On the times I can relax the area, I feel like I can last as much as I want(even though i'm going really slow and focus very hard).
              The problem is that this is like a reflex at this point. I'm not sure it's about tension in the area or anything like this. The question is how to you re-train you mind and body to stop this reflex

              Comment


              • #8
                I have the exact same problem as you Bbxer! and have tried everything you have to no avail.

                I also have slowly built up stimulation to the point where i could last forever.. but have trouble repeating it!

                I've tried stretched but dont seem to have the flexibility in my hips to allow for pelvic floor stretching.. but im working on it!

                I strongly endorse this thread! Help is much appreciated guys

                Comment


                • #9
                  What is your out of sex rk/k routine what are you up to?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Pegasus View Post
                    What is your out of sex rk/k routine what are you up to?
                    I'm doing level 0.2 on Minuteman's dry orgasm guide. I can proceed to the next level(s) but I want to focus on isolation - and this stage seems like the perfect thing for this.
                    I also do rubber band kegels as explained in the theory forum. I do 5-6 sets of 10-12, 3 times a week. (I'm doing RKs as well on the same "workout" to balance things).
                    I addition to that, I do massage with tennis ball everyday.

                    Again, i'm not sure it's about the pelvic floor balance and strength or about actively relaxing the pelvic floor during sex using rk. These things will help prolong and have better control for sure - but it seems more advanced.
                    The root of the problem is that my body is conditioned to contract the pelvic floor on every "stroke" - as long as I stroke, there is contraction(if its 1 stroke or 10 strokes - it will only relax when I stop). It is also not correlated to my arousal and/or erection scale - I can be at 4-5 arousal scale, and 6-7 erection scale("decent erection") and still have contraction on every stroke. Again, it's like a reflex to remove your hand when you put it on something hot -as soon as I have stimulation, "boom" - there is a contraction.

                    It seems like i'm not the only one with that issue so maybe figuring it out will be a big breakthrough for a lot of people.
                    I don't think the solution will be easy, it would probably take long time to re-train our body/mind to stop this reflex. The issue is that I don't know how to re-train it because it is a reflex - I can't not do it at this point, so how I can re-train myself to not do it on a regular basis? I hope it make sense.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by bbxer View Post
                      The root of the problem is that my body is conditioned to contract the pelvic floor on every "stroke" - as long as I stroke, there is contraction(if its 1 stroke or 10 strokes - it will only relax when I stop). It is also not correlated to my arousal and/or erection scale - I can be at 4-5 arousal scale, and 6-7 erection scale("decent erection") and still have contraction on every stroke. Again, it's like a reflex to remove your hand when you put it on something hot -as soon as I have stimulation, "boom" - there is a contraction.
                      First of all you must fix this issue first. This is what is causing your muscle to contract on every stroke. Abandon your regular kegal for a while and do only a rk + breathing and stretching routines for some time. For me, trying to be multi-orgasmic has been a bad idea because it requires a lot of regular kegal and that brings involuntary contraction back.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by bbxer View Post
                        I'm doing level 0.2 on Minuteman's dry orgasm guide. I can proceed to the next level(s) but I want to focus on isolation - and this stage seems like the perfect thing for this.
                        I also do rubber band kegels as explained in the theory forum. I do 5-6 sets of 10-12, 3 times a week. (I'm doing RKs as well on the same "workout" to balance things).
                        I addition to that, I do massage with tennis ball everyday.

                        Again, i'm not sure it's about the pelvic floor balance and strength or about actively relaxing the pelvic floor during sex using rk. These things will help prolong and have better control for sure - but it seems more advanced.
                        The root of the problem is that my body is conditioned to contract the pelvic floor on every "stroke" - as long as I stroke, there is contraction(if its 1 stroke or 10 strokes - it will only relax when I stop). It is also not correlated to my arousal and/or erection scale - I can be at 4-5 arousal scale, and 6-7 erection scale("decent erection") and still have contraction on every stroke. Again, it's like a reflex to remove your hand when you put it on something hot -as soon as I have stimulation, "boom" - there is a contraction.

                        It seems like i'm not the only one with that issue so maybe figuring it out will be a big breakthrough for a lot of people.
                        I don't think the solution will be easy, it would probably take long time to re-train our body/mind to stop this reflex. The issue is that I don't know how to re-train it because it is a reflex - I can't not do it at this point, so how I can re-train myself to not do it on a regular basis? I hope it make sense.
                        The rubber band k is too much for you at this point,

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          So you have too much tension in your pelvic floor and you're currently doing an intensive strengthening program yet you can't figure out why you still can't relax your pelvic floor.

                          Forget about being DO/MMO at the moment and instead focus on releasing the tension in your PF and only once you've done that start strengthening it again.
                          On a break from the forum
                          imac's Phallosan Forte Progress Log
                          Pelvic Floor Balance
                          Confusion With Reverse Kegels

                          Reverse Kegel Breathing (Meditative Reverse Kegels)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            imac/Pegasus:
                            It's not about the tension in the pelvic floor muscles.
                            If we are trying to demystify things, then the pelvic floor is just a skeletal muscle. As such, if you want to properly train it - you need to treat it like such if we want maximum results(there is a lot of information in the RBK thread in the theory forum, you can also google "training skeletal muscles").
                            In addition to the above, I do specific isolation exercises in order to have better control and understanding the muscles in the area(Minuteman's program), because it is important to identify and control the specific muscles in the pelvic floor if you want to learn to control them.
                            I balance everything with equal amount of RK(to stretch the area), and tennis ball massage(myofascial release). This is in order to relax the area and release the tension.
                            This is the same as any other skeletal muscle training.

                            The reflex of "contraction due to stimulation" is not directly related to the above. Especially since I do stretching and myofascial release in order to avoid tension in the pelvic floor.
                            I guess it has something to do with years of contracting the pelvic floor while masturbating/having sex because it feels good(or any other reason), and by this creating a bad habit of contracting the area whenever there is stimulation.
                            Breaking this habit is the first step to having control over your ejaculatory respond(because the contractions lead to rapid spasm which lead to orgasm and ejaculation).

                            I gave the analogy of "removing my hand from something hot" reflex several times, and I think it is perfectly relevant.
                            If your body is programmed to automatically remove the hand whenever it touches something hot - it doesn't matter if there is tension in the hand. You need to first re-program your body/mind to not remove the hand whenever you touch something hot. For people like me(from people commenting it seems like i'm not the only one), the pelvic floor contraction due to stimulation is just like the "removing my hand from something hot" reflex - so it's not directly related to tension.


                            I did a lot of reading on the last few weeks(mainly here, a lot of great posts), and I think this is a missing piece which cause problem to a lot of people.
                            First you need to learn how to break this reflex, and then learn to control everything using all the techniques people teach here.
                            The question is how to you re-learn train your reflex?


                            PS
                            I read this reply before I posted and it came out a bit arrogant. This was not my intention at all - i'm here to learn.
                            All I wanted to do is give my logical perspective and hopefully start a discussion which might end up with good implication for me and for other people.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Reflex is only part of the issue and is adressed with edgeing,arousal control etc. The physical issues are adressed with k/rk training out of sex , stretching massage etc. Your understanding of the physical training is incomplete strength is only one aspect

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